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  1. #1
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    Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    Is it just me, or ....
    It seems to me that when I toggle between Portrait/Landscape, it would be nice if the margins changed too.
    Example: regular letter-size document, Portrait mode, Top & Bottom = 180 pts; Left & Right = 90 pts.
    When I switch to Landscape mode I find Top & Bottom = 90 pts; Left & Right = 180 pts.

    Effect? Header/Footer which required 180 pts is now squeezed into 90 pts, and the data, which lacked space when side margins were 90+90 now has less space with margins at 180+180.

    That is, if my reason for switching to Landscape were to give my text more breathing space horizontally, I'm getting less that I might expect (depends on the real T/B/L/R settings of course).

    The little macro below demonstrates how I think it should work:<pre>Type typPageSU
    lngBottomMargin As Long
    lngLeftMargin As Long
    lngRightMargin As Long
    lngTopMargin As Long
    End Type
    Sub TogglePageLayoutMode()
    Dim pu As typPageSU
    With ActiveDocument.Range.Sections(1).PageSetup
    ' Preserve margins
    pu.lngBottomMargin = .BottomMargin
    pu.lngTopMargin = .TopMargin
    pu.lngLeftMargin = .LeftMargin
    pu.lngRightMargin = .RightMargin
    If .Orientation = wdOrientPortrait Then
    .Orientation = wdOrientLandscape
    Else
    .Orientation = wdOrientPortrait
    End If
    ' Restore margins
    .BottomMargin = pu.lngBottomMargin
    .TopMargin = pu.lngTopMargin
    .LeftMargin = pu.lngLeftMargin
    .RightMargin = pu.lngRightMargin
    End With
    End Sub</pre>


  2. #2
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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    While Word tries to outguess the user in many situations where it's not wanted, its behavior at page orientation changes is decidedly unhelpful. Another point of irritation is tab positions in the header and footer: by default, the header and footer have a center-aligned tab in the middle and a right-aligned tab at the right margin for portrait pages. This is not changed when you switch to landscape, leaving the tab positions in useless locations.

  3. #3
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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    > its behavior at page orientation changes is decidedly unhelpful
    Thanks for the response, Hans.
    Also:
    Oh Good. I thought it was me! <img src=/S/sarcasm.gif border=0 alt=sarcasm width=15 height=15>

    >Another point of irritation is tab positions in the header and footer
    ... etc etc.

    I'm looking at a specific task where the user wants the page structure to be visually identical when riffling through the book, but effectively rotating the core text of the page through 90.
    Using Word's user interface this seems to boil down to dirtying one's hands with everything except the core text. That is, changing the orientation so that the page "lies flat", adjusting the margins, adjusting the header settings (width, tabs etc), adjusting the size of text boxes deposited in the headers/footers (primary/even/odd) (for each section) (of each story range), ...
    It seems to require that in order to lay out the core text in landscape mode, the very headers should appear as text boxes with the header text counter-rotated 90. Aaaaargh.

    At this stage I'm seeing a general-purpose orientation function that accepts various parameters that (DNA-like) trigger behavior appropriate to the cause.

    A user with a 23cm text box down the margins of a portrait page isn't going to be happy when the text box, all 23cm of it, is rotated and presented down the side of a landscape version with a page height of 21cm. Should I just squeeze the text box? Widen it and induces two lines of text where there were one?

    Maybe MSoft threw in the towel at a very early stage of the game.

  4. #4
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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    Happily scraping the bottom of the barrel .... <post:=1,117>post 1,117</post:> <img src=/S/bingo.gif border=0 alt=bingo width=15 height=22> <img src=/S/clapping.gif border=0 alt=clapping width=19 height=23> <img src=/S/bravo.gif border=0 alt=bravo width=16 height=30> <img src=/S/clever.gif border=0 alt=clever width=15 height=15> <img src=/S/cool.gif border=0 alt=cool width=15 height=15> <img src=/S/exclamation.gif border=0 alt=exclamation width=15 height=15> <img src=/S/groovin.gif border=0 alt=groovin width=21 height=21> <img src=/S/hailpraise.gif border=0 alt=hailpraise width=27 height=22> <img src=/S/joy.gif border=0 alt=joy width=23 height=23> <img src=/S/salute.gif border=0 alt=salute width=15 height=20> <img src=/S/skipping.gif border=0 alt=skipping width=30 height=30> <img src=/S/starstruck.gif border=0 alt=starstruck width=15 height=15> <img src=/S/thumbup.gif border=0 alt=thumbup width=15 height=15> <img src=/S/yikes.gif border=0 alt=yikes width=15 height=15>

  5. #5
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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    My take on this is that the margins are normally there to allow for space when binding the printout and I think it is a good thing that the margins rotate with the page rotation. This means that the binding space you put on the left hand long edge will be on the top of a landscape page since you will bind the document with the long edges lined up. I can see it is not completely obvious but I do believe that there is a reason for the behaviour you see.

    The tabs being in the wrong position for the landscape page is an annoyance though, as is the link to previous being defaulted to on so that when you fix the landscape header the previous portrait section goes bad.

    I prefer to use 100% width tables instead of the centre and right align tabs in headers and footers. That way you can change the page width without having to reposition the tabs.
    Andrew Lockton, Chrysalis Design, Melbourne Australia

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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    Having used a number of DTP packages, I can tell you that dealing with rotated pages is a pain to manage in the DTP packages as well. Both Word and DTP packages allow page rotation but neither are simple 'out of the box' to change page setup inside a document. Of course, once you have done it once, it is easy to reapply to other areas in the document. In the DTP packages you would apply a different page master, in Word, I copy a section break. Word has the great benefit of autotexts and macros which can assist greatly but they do take time to setup.

    No matter what package you are using, working through the possibilities of laying out content that requires an alternative page rotation is always time-consuming and is rarely a binary decision (information can be presented in more ways than just portrait and landscape). In large docs that I do in Word, besides the decision on the most suitable content layout, I may also have to choose between A4 portrait, A4 landscape, A3 portrait bifold and A3 landscape bifold. All will end up in a bound A4 sized folder but there are some twists and turns on the way.

    Personally, I always try to consider the actual information being presented, the target audience will use the information and the possible layouts for the information before making the 'simple' decision to rotate the page. Once you decide that you NEED to use a different page layout then you also need to decide on margins and headers. It is generally preferable to rearrange the information to fit the same layout as the rest of your document but there are times when this is not feasible and both WP and DTP software allow this to happen but it is never as simple as 'portrait or landscape'.
    Andrew Lockton, Chrysalis Design, Melbourne Australia

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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    No, WordPerfect also maintained header and footer positions as they are done in bookwork.

    Pam
    Pam Caswell

  8. #8
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    Re: Maintaining portrait landscape margins (Word 2000 et al.)

    >the margins are normally there to allow for space when binding the printout
    Makes complete sense to me; thank you, Andrew.

    (later) After mulling for a day or two, I think I see that this is really a desk-top publishing problem.
    I've not ever used Ventura, or anything that came after it, but I now suspect that a Word-processor is good at processing words, and a publisher is good at publishing documents, and that, all too often, I try to make Word behave like something it isn't.

    Perhaps a bona fide DTP user out there will confirm this: that the business of rotating the body of a page while retaining the header/margins orientation is really DTP rather than WP.

    Don't laugh; I've led a sheltered life (grin!)

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