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  1. #1
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    Because you will carry over any noise or garbage from the previous installation. Been there done that and figured out back in 95 to 98 what was best. Backup your stuff and do Full install where you format the hard drive wiping all trash from it and get a brand new system.
    You can do that even with an upgrade disk and proper Product key of course.

    Backup your Pictures, Music or whatever to an external USB drive or second hard drive.
    Quit using MS created Folders like MY Documents, My Pictures. Use something on the second drive and start saving everything there. If your system gets a virus or whatever most times it won't affect the second drive.

    Best part of this is if a virus or whatever gets your main drive then you can re install and still have all your stuff.

  2. #2
    2 Star Lounger zigzag3143's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Van Graham View Post
    Because you will carry over any noise or garbage from the previous installation. Been there done that and figured out back in 95 to 98 what was best. Backup your stuff and do Full install where you format the hard drive wiping all trash from it and get a brand new system.
    You can do that even with an upgrade disk and proper Product key of course.

    Backup your Pictures, Music or whatever to an external USB drive or second hard drive.
    Quit using MS created Folders like MY Documents, My Pictures. Use something on the second drive and start saving everything there. If your system gets a virus or whatever most times it won't affect the second drive.

    Best part of this is if a virus or whatever gets your main drive then you can re install and still have all your stuff.

    Van Hi and welcome


    I cant tell you how right you are. I have had to help ppl fix upgraded installs with blue screens, and countless other problems. Microsoft recommends it, I do and most people who support win 7 do. You are on the money with your suggestions

    thnaks

    Ken
    Microsoft Most Valuable Professional-- Windows Expert Consumer 2009---2015
    MCC 2013-2015

    Wanikiyi & Dyami--Team ZigZag3143

  3. #3
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    My favorite way to "upgrade" to a new OS is to buy a new disk and install it there. All the old stuff is still available on the old disk. Even works for a laptop - you can get an external drive enclosure that lets you use the old drive as a USB drive. And when you decide that you have gotten everything off the drive that you want (I put mine aside for a year or more just to make sure), you can wipe the drive and have lots of extra external storage for backups and whatnot.

  4. #4
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    When you install a new OS, install it into its own partition. Keep all your user data on the other partition(s). Then when you next install an OS, you only need to format the primary partition to install the OS 'fresh'. All your data is still intact on the other partition(s). Save much messing around backing up your data for a reinstall. But it does not negate the need to regularly backup your data somewhere safe.

  5. #5
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    Your advise is mostly nonsense. By your own admission, you are basing your advise on experience that is over a decade old. Any quirks that successfully get migrated by an in-place upgrade are, almost by definition, configuration quirks and one could easily claim that such quirks can easily be corrected and/or that they will quickly be reintroduced even with a clean install.

    The bottom line is that a in-place upgrade MIGHT migrate a quirk or problem that MIGHT require a reinstall of the OS.

    A clean install will ALWAYS require the re-installation, reconfiguration and re-updating of ALL applications with the attendant problems of finding source material and re-licensing or reregistration.

    The proper preparation for an in-place upgrade fully prepares one for doing a clean install should it become necessary. There is almost nothing to be lost in an in-place upgrade attempt. In most cases it works just fine. In those cases where it does not, little has been lost beyond a couple hours spent watching the in-place upgrade attempt.

    BTW, your advise to use a separate drive for user data storage has merit. Your advise to stop using the Microsoft designated folders does not.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chet Copeland View Post
    Your advise is mostly nonsense. By your own admission, you are basing your advise on experience that is over a decade old. Any quirks that successfully get migrated by an in-place upgrade are, almost by definition, configuration quirks and one could easily claim that such quirks can easily be corrected and/or that they will quickly be reintroduced even with a clean install.
    I posted this cause within first 15 posts here are so many upgrade and now problems

    Wrong, been there done that(experience) means a lot more than following MS like a blind rat. MS can't even get their help documentation correct and I'm gonna blindly follow them? not me

    With Win 7 I thought I'd give upgrade a try since I had my backup on external drive and went for a Vista 64 to Seven 64 just to see if anything improved and first thing was my actual installed backup drive was not readable. I tried everything under the sun like icacls, Take ownership to regain permissions and so forth. What was MS help to say, convert to ms type Dynamic drive, well rest is history lost what I had on that drive. I wouldn't use that MS Dynamic drive type either make it a basic.

    Yes requires a little work collecting your drivers and saving them off but whats the worse happen. Worst case is Win don't recognize a new type Sata drive where you need drivers on a floppy/usb or either injected into the install. Or maybe if it recognizes your drives on 7 you hit the desktop and screen resolution is 640 x 480. Either let WU find a driver or install from backup drive. You can inject all Drivers and Update's into your install media with Dism

  7. #7
    Super Moderator CLiNT's Avatar
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    I totally agree with the clean instal over an upgrade. Too many potential issues in an upgrade instalation of an os.

    Not everone has a system in A1 shape prior to upgrade. Many might not even realize they have a issue until the
    upgrade fails or produces funky/unintended results.
    DRIVE IMAGING
    Invest a little time and energy in a well thought out BACKUP regimen and you will have minimal down time, and headache.

    Build your own system; get everything you want and nothing you don't.
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  8. #8
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    As stated in many other posts, I am also in the clean install camp. Chet, perhaps because of your routines, perhaps in place upgrade works for you and that's great, but for the unlimited less informed or less experienced users, who do not have or know how to obtain pristine PCs before an in place upgrade, that option is fraught with pitfalls. There are way more problems for those people than solutions. I am not necessarily stating a format should be done before the clean install, although that is one possible senario that would work. You would have to ensure your data is available, but a clean install over your existing OS actually helps to save your data because it creates a folder called windows.old which contains your entire old OS. This folder can be opened and data dragged to the new OS. Obviously, if you have significant problems with the old OS, then a reformat would most likely help to resolve software problems. To conclude, in my opinion, for the vast majority of people out there, a clean install is a safer option, and as stated by others, the time involved is less than you might expect. The time you would take to clean up the old OS to allow a successful in place upgrade could be better used getting the newer drivers for the new OS. This will ensure the latest and greatest for your brand new OS.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
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  9. #9
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    Thought about this and changed the title to 'If possible don't use upgrade do Full Install'

    I use the format myself. My first PC was probably formatted 150 times and it still running. Someone plays the old windows games I had on it. And yes after someone has a PC awhile and installing updates out the Kazoo before they released a SP a PC will become very congested. If I remember correctly there was like 88+ on XP before first SP. I count 27 updates for 7 64 bit since it was released in my Updates folder I add into my installations.

    I know some are not tech savvy and might not know the difference between an update and a driver but most have family or a friend who is a computer wiz that probably uses these methods.

    I started with XP and developed a program where it does all these things for you by something called Unattended. Injects updates, drivers, and adds all my applications including serial, registration and so forth. Doesn't take that much knowledge if you can read.
    I didn't come here to promote that but I had been reading WS for awhile and finally have a little time to look over their forums.

  10. #10
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    When I upgraded to Win 7 Pro from Vista Ultimate last November, I too wanted to start afresh. However I did an upgrade because I had two pieces of software that I knew which could not re-install and successfully register for another time. I already had my data on a separate partition. Thus I purchased the laplink software to copy over specific applications and upgraded that way. It was the best compromise that I could do.

    It has worked out very well and I have no regrets.

    Having said that, if I did not need the two applications, I would have done a fresh install.
    Seymour

  11. #11
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    I can't really add much to my reasons for recommending the in-place upgrade over the clean install upgrade. I believe the former offers an excellent chance of success, especially for the naive user who would have difficulty navigating the hazards of trying to reinstall, reconfigure, re-update and re-register each and every application they own. There is no doubt in my mind that an in-place upgrade is the far simpler process for the user and the only reasons being offered here for a clean install upgrade are based on an imagined POSSIBLE problem.

    A fresh start, such as is provided a reinstall of everything, may have some merit in some circumstances but such an undertaking can be done at any time including anytime after an upgrade, should a user feel it might be necessary or beneficial. It is simply not true that it is necessary or even desirable for everyone and complicating an upgrade with the complexities of a clean install seems a very poor general recommendation.

    All that aside, I think it is worthwhile pointing out that both mechanisms are an 'upgrade'. As far as I know, all earlier versions of Windows are eligible for an upgrade and the only time a full Windows 7 package must be purchased is if it is destined for a newly created system such as a home build. Both the current and former title of this thread, and some of the posts, may be misleading.

  12. #12
    2 Star Lounger
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    I feel there are plenty of situations where upgrading is a reasonable choice. And as Sunrisecc reports, it certainly can work. As I understand it, you can't really upgrade from anything but Vista, right? Upgrading from XP is really a clean install with settings copied across, and then apps migrated. I think that's correct, please tell me if not. Seems that XP-to-7 is going to be the big upgrade. In my limited experience any maching that will run XP well, will run 7 just as well.

    But I digress...in the end my opinion is that for the regular home user an upgrade is fine. I've spent far too much time in areas like the Adobe user forums, and odd problems can sometimes be traced back to OS upgrades. But, that crowd is using specialty fonts, and complicated software suites generally. So who knows.

    What I want is a Win 7 Upgrade Advisor that doesn't require a live Internet connection.

  13. #13
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    Sunrisecc,
    Everything can be captured using something like Installwatch Pro to track the changes.
    Even do MS Office since it came with PC and once done it's updated with all updates.

    Chet,
    I don't do upgrades except for others need my help on their machine and want to do that because they afraid of losing their pics and stuff but I explain all these things to them. Catch a bad enough virus you lose everything also a lot of times so it's the same. Never had any luck removing viruses or rather don't trust it's gone, best way is format and start over to insure clean machine, simple.
    Keep your stuff backed up which is most important to something external... before the virii get you.

    I format and start over each time and haven't lost anything from any of my applications. Firefox- all my stuff, Thunderbird- all my stuff and the 20 to 60 other things I use. Have done hundreds of installs cause i need to see exactly whats going on for my Unattended tests. Virtual Machine wasn't worth a darn till recently but it's still lacking and doesn't support all hardware

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by veegertx View Post
    Sunrisecc,
    Everything can be captured using something like Installwatch Pro to track the changes.
    Kinda hard to capture an installtion done many years ago. Also a re-install would work but there was an online rehistration process that is no longer available. It is not like MS Money where registration is no longer needed. The accounting package still works and there no need to convert it to a newer software.

    All I am saying, that a blanket statement is nice in principle but that there are also many outside factors. The laplink software preserved the two online registrations required that I could no longer perform.
    Seymour

  15. #15
    Super Moderator Deadeye81's Avatar
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    Chet,

    Quoting statements from your two posts:

    "Your advise is mostly nonsense."

    "....the only reasons being offered here for a clean install upgrade are based on an imagined POSSIBLE problem." (italics are mine)

    "It is simply not true that it is necessary or even desirable for everyone and complicating an upgrade with the complexities of a clean install seems a very poor general recommendation."

    "All that aside, I think it is worthwhile pointing out that both mechanisms are an 'upgrade'. As far as I know, all earlier versions of Windows are eligible for an upgrade and the only time a full Windows 7 package must be purchased is if it is destined for a newly created system such as a home build. Both the current and former title of this thread, and some of the posts, may be misleading."

    First, the chosen words and tone of some remarks is a violation of Lounge Rule 9. Courtesy is a necessary ingredient in encouraging the free flow of ideas, and I am certain that is something we all want here.

    Second, the context of "upgrade" in this thread makes it clear that the difference of opinion is in regard to "in place" versus "custom install" upgrades, both of which can be performed using the upgrade editions of Windows 7. There is merit to both sides of this issue, however regardless of the reasons, there are many who have had difficulties with the "in place" upgrade process. Fortunately, not everyone has had a negative experience with the "in place" upgrade option.
    Deadeye81

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