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  1. #1
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    I ordered Paragon 10 Pro backup and found it even more difficult to use than Acronis True Image. These image creation programs give me fits (the old Ghost crashed my machine). I'm back to Paragon free. I tried to do a full backup of the C hard drive to a Seagate 640G external drive, but can't access the three Paragon files (see attached screen capture). I get strange messages when I click on them. I used Acronis for years with no problem, but over the last few months, I can't seem to complete an image backup. Very frustrating. Ellen
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellen Camner View Post
    I ordered Paragon 10 Pro backup and found it even more difficult to use than Acronis True Image. These image creation programs give me fits (the old Ghost crashed my machine). I'm back to Paragon free. I tried to do a full backup of the C hard drive to a Seagate 640G external drive, but can't access the three Paragon files (see attached screen capture). I get strange messages when I click on them. I used Acronis for years with no problem, but over the last few months, I can't seem to complete an image backup. Very frustrating. Ellen
    Ellen,
    Hello.. You mention Acronis True Image . What version are you using? and what "OS" . I have tried and used "TI" from 11, 2009, and now 2010. Ive also tried out "Paragon" (free version") and it worked but it lacked the features of "Acronis TI". If you do a " Full Image Backup" (not incremental) and run the backup from "Windows" It should be a "piece of cake" As long as you don't try to do the "schedule thing" (had nothing but problems from 2009 on) Post back with details, and we will try to help you get "your image" going again. Regards Fred
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ellen Camner View Post
    I ordered Paragon 10 Pro backup and found it even more difficult to use than Acronis True Image. These image creation programs give me fits (the old Ghost crashed my machine). I'm back to Paragon free. I tried to do a full backup of the C hard drive to a Seagate 640G external drive, but can't access the three Paragon files (see attached screen capture). I get strange messages when I click on them. I used Acronis for years with no problem, but over the last few months, I can't seem to complete an image backup. Very frustrating. Ellen
    My sympathies - sorry can't offer a solution.

    I am brand new user of Paragon backup (not pro) FREE and it works like a charm for me. Admittedly my backup is not more than 15gb and I managed to restore/recreate it successfully on my laptop. The conclusion is why pay for something that doesn't work while the free version does - strange eh! :0).
    Thanks.
    Robie

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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    The following is from my experiences with Acronis, but similar advice will apply to nearly any full-featured backup and recovery program (like Paragon full version) :

    Archives created with Acronis True Image Home can only be read and used for two versions ahead. So if you upgraded True Image, and had older backups from more than two versions ago, you may not be able to access and use those backups.

    Also, if your backups included Increments, and the original Full Backups for those Imcrements have been deleted or corrupted, the entire backup set will be useless. That's true for any backup and recovery program.

    Before making any backup, scan your computer for viruses, as they may interfere with making a backup. And clean up the computer with CCleaner to get a smaller, more stable backup.

    You can set Acronis to do automatic backups on a schedule, and leave it on all-defaults, except for choosing to back up the entire C:Windows partition to the destination folder on an external hard drive. As long as the drive is attached and the computer is running when the backup task is scheduled, no further fooling around is needed. That is the simple way to use Acronis True Image. The only tricky part is the initial Acronis setup. Other backup programs may have similar scheduling features.

    It is often necessary to shut down all background processes to get Acronis to make a complete backup. Some folks go so far as to run Acronis from Windows Safe Mode or even to use the Acronis disk-based backup (from the Acronis Recovery CD), so that nothing is active on the computer which is being backed up. Other backup programs may also benefit from taking these precautions.

    (Note speciic to Acronis Scheduler: This feature has had several posts in the Lounge, and it appears that there may be problems with Acronis Scheduler. But in this thread we are talking about Paragon Backup, and I haven't read anything similar about the scheduled backups feature of Paragon.)

    No backup should be kept longer than one year, nor through more than four Windows Updates cycles, whichever comes first. A new, full image backup should then be made, and all older backups should be discarded. Otherwise, restoring Windows can become too error-prone for any good use.
    -- Bob Primak --

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    5 Star Lounger ibe98765's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Primak View Post
    Before making any backup, scan your computer for viruses, as they may interfere with making a backup. And clean up the computer with CCleaner to get a smaller, more stable backup.
    I think that would be quite unnecessary and anyway, who has the time to do a virus scan and run CCleaner before EVERY backup???

    I have multiple logical drives and I use Acronis TI 2010 Home to do backups weekly. MY C: & D: drives get backed up 3 times a week. Others, twice, once or bi-weekly.

    The last time I encountered a REAL virus was way back in 1997 and that came from a work file I brought home on a floppy. I don't think experienced users see viruses very often these days.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Primak View Post
    Archives created with Acronis True Image Home can only be read and used for two versions ahead. So if you upgraded True Image, and had older backups from more than two versions ago, you may not be able to access and use those backups.
    Where did you find this info on the two version back limit? Is this from Acronis, something you have personally experienced or simply hearsay?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Primak View Post
    It is often necessary to shut down all background processes to get Acronis to make a complete backup. Some folks go so far as to run Acronis from Windows Safe Mode or even to use the Acronis disk-based backup (from the Acronis Recovery CD), so that nothing is active on the computer which is being backed up. Other backup programs may also benefit from taking these precautions.
    Bob, you sound like you are living 5-10 years in the past with most of your recommendations. Anyone using Acronis TI 2010 Home should not have to shut down processes, go into safe mode or lordy, DOS to do an image! And also going outside of Windows would screw up any auto scheduling you had set up in Windows.

    That being said, there are a few things I would recommend from using something like the last 5 versions of Acronis TI that you did not mention:

    1. ALWAYS set the option to do a VALIDATE after an image operation
    2. ALWAYS do an email notification so you can be sure that the image job actually worked.
    3. Every once in a while, check that you can at least successfully open a good archive in BOTH Windows and DOS.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ibeme View Post
    I think that would be quite unnecessary and anyway, who has the time to do a virus scan and run CCleaner before EVERY backup???







    Where did you find this info on the two version back limit? Is this from Acronis, something you have personally experienced or simply hearsay?
    ibeme,
    Hello, I agree with Bob on most of his points. As to running CCleaner to rid yourself of unwanted "files" as an example ... I use 2010 \ 7046 TI home. My last backup after fooling with a printer problem (hours) came out to be 11.5 GB (approx compressed) this was about 2.5GB larger that my normal compressed backup.?? .... Because i forgot to do my usual clean up routine (another senior moment) CCleaner , revo , disk clean up, etc. I had several GB worth of "temp files" added to the backup ( even though i had the box in TI to ignore "temp files ticked off)
    As far as Acronis and the two version limit (backwards \ forwards) ) ..... that comes out of Acronis, and have read that on there forum since before they changed from "Wilders Security Forum" to there own. I think that every TI version (since 10) uses this as a "general warning" that sometimes older vs newer may or may not work, or "play nice together" Regards Fred
    PlainFred

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    5 Star Lounger ibe98765's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fred J Usack View Post
    ibeme,
    Hello, I agree with Bob on most of his points. As to running CCleaner to rid yourself of unwanted "files" as an example ... I use 2010 \ 7046 TI home. My last backup after fooling with a printer problem (hours) came out to be 11.5 GB (approx compressed) this was about 2.5GB larger that my normal compressed backup.?? .... Because i forgot to do my usual clean up routine (another senior moment) CCleaner , revo , disk clean up, etc. I had several GB worth of "temp files" added to the backup ( even though i had the box in TI to ignore "temp files ticked off)
    As far as Acronis and the two version limit (backwards \ forwards) ) ..... that comes out of Acronis, and have read that on there forum since before they changed from "Wilders Security Forum" to there own. I think that every TI version (since 10) uses this as a "general warning" that sometimes older vs newer may or may not work, or "play nice together" Regards Fred
    11.5GB backup? [rofl] My logical disk backups totaled 85GB this week (and I don't back up everything either). You do know that 2TB hard drives are down to around $100 these days? Why would you worry about 2.5GB one way or another?

    I don't have a problem with temp file backup because 1) I manually delete them every evening. and 2) Temp file are on a separate physical drive which I don't backup because there is nothing but junk out there. You should consider doing the same.

    There are threads here and elsewhere about people (including myself) who got their systems hosed up running registry cleaning programs. Personally, I wouldn't recommend running these programs more than very occasionally (like every 3-6 months max). [shrug]

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    Quote Originally Posted by ibeme View Post
    Why would you worry about 2.5GB one way or another?

    I don't have a problem with temp file backup because 1) I manually delete them every evening. and 2) Temp file are on a separate physical drive which I don't backup because there is nothing but junk out there. You should consider doing the same.
    ibeme,
    Well, you are correct in 2.5GB is not that much. However i like to keep backups for all my systems 5 OS's ( 5 hard drives internal and 2 external) At last count i have about (roughly) 60 or so backups of many different kinds, and in different places....... see my point? why would i want a couple hundred GB of "junk files"? if it wasn't necessary. So ..... in using "Revo" and CCleaner to do this .... i don't have to "do it manually" As far as another drive for junk ..... Where? Regards Fred
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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    ibeme said:
    Posted 2010-06-26 21:57
    Bob Primak, on 2010-06-26 12:55, said:

    Before making any backup, scan your computer for viruses, as they may interfere with making a backup. And clean up the computer with CCleaner to get a smaller, more stable backup.

    I think that would be quite unnecessary and anyway, who has the time to do a virus scan and run CCleaner before EVERY backup???

    I have multiple logical drives and I use Acronis TI 2010 Home to do backups weekly. MY C: & D: drives get backed up 3 times a week. Others, twice, once or bi-weekly.

    The last time I encountered a REAL virus was way back in 1997 and that came from a work file I brought home on a floppy. I don't think experienced users see viruses very often these days.
    It is not realistic to think you can never get a virus. And backing up a virus-infected drive or partition is an exercise in futility. Nothing would be more frustrating or time-consuming than to do a restoration and then find out that it is already infected, or quickly becomes infected because of an undetected backdoor. It can happen to anyone. Running all my virus scans (most thorough modes) is an overnight operation, and does not cut into productive computer use time when done in a disciplined way. And I have never heard of anyone getting their computers wrecked by using the CCleaner Registry cleaner. It is not very aggressive, but it helps in ways other than saving disk space.

    Another thing which limits the size of my backups is the fact that I use a separate partition for my data. Most folks do not do this. Go ahead and call this practice 5 to 10 years out of date, but it still is the single most effective way to limit backup times and archive sizes. It isn't about saving disk space -- it is about saving time and making more consistent and reliable backups.

    These recommendations are nowhere 5 to 10 years out of date. They are current, and the same recommendations can be found at any number of websites, including PC World, PC Magazine, Maximum PC, etc. And occasionally in Fred Langa's Windows Secrets columns.

    Acronis has not used DOS since it first came out. Neither has Paragon, and Paragon is the program referenced in the OP's question.

    Background processes can and do mess up backup operations. The Lounge has had several threads, possibly including this one, in which exactly this has happened to people, even on the most modern Windows PCs. Some users limit Startups, but a lot of folks do not, and then they wonder why True Image stops in the middle of a backup. That is the reason I mentioned background processes and how to avoid or limit them during backup operations. Personally, I run my Acronis Backups from within Windows XP Pro, SP3. But I have severely limited Startups and Background Processes on my laptop. Even so, I find that I have to exit my firewall, stay off the Internet, and shut down the Avast Active Shields to get reliable backups. Backups are important enough to me to justify taking great care when making them.

    I can understand not running full AV scans every time you do backups if you are doing these backups three times a week. Most of us are only backing up one to three drives, and only once a week or so. But any backup without a virus scan is at risk of being infected.

    Some people think everything is automatic with computers, and they trust everything. These are the people who inevitably get their computers so messed up that they have to reformat and reinstall. Nothing personal implied here.
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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fred J Usack View Post
    ibeme,
    Hello, I agree with Bob on most of his points. As to running CCleaner to rid yourself of unwanted "files" as an example ... I use 2010 \ 7046 TI home. My last backup after fooling with a printer problem (hours) came out to be 11.5 GB (approx compressed) this was about 2.5GB larger that my normal compressed backup.?? .... Because i forgot to do my usual clean up routine (another senior moment) CCleaner , revo , disk clean up, etc. I had several GB worth of "temp files" added to the backup ( even though i had the box in TI to ignore "temp files ticked off)
    As far as Acronis and the two version limit (backwards \ forwards) ) ..... that comes out of Acronis, and have read that on there forum since before they changed from "Wilders Security Forum" to there own. I think that every TI version (since 10) uses this as a "general warning" that sometimes older vs newer may or may not work, or "play nice together" Regards Fred
    Thank you, Fred for coming to my defense. And yes, Acronis has a support FAQ which explicitly states that Acronis archives are only readable for two versions.

    As my post above shows, I am capable of defending my own positions, but a little added support is always appreciated.

    Cheers, Bob
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Primak View Post
    Another thing which limits the size of my backups is the fact that I use a separate partition for my data. Most folks do not do this. Go ahead and call this practice 5 to 10 years out of date, but it still is the single most effective way to limit backup times and archive sizes. It isn't about saving disk space -- it is about saving time and making more consistent and reliable backups.
    I have used the same philosophy (separate partitions for data files) for several years. It makes it VERY easy to restore a backup for drive C, since I don't have to worry about losing any data on that drive.

    When my computer system gets messed up (such as registry problems caused by a botched software install), it only takes about 15 minutes to restore from backup. I run my Acronis backups every week at 3 AM on Sunday. I typically wait until Monday to install new software programs.
    Rick Groszkiewicz
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    Fred and Bob, I also agree with you two. I also clean things up as much as possible before imaging my OS. I wonder if ibeme is doing images or incremental back ups. I do not image as often, usually about once per month. And yes, my image is also less than 30 GB.

    I have started another thread listing step by step instructions for creating an image. The first entry (mine) is using Acronis True Image Home 2010. My hope is that other will also add step by step instructions for others imaging apps as well. It might be handy to have these instructions in a common area. If someone sees a problem with what I have posted please e-mail me so I may make corrections. Ted
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    I had a problem allowing Acronis True Image Home 2009 to make a partition on my C:\ and then by activating started up recovery manager on my Toshiba Vista Home Premium. The computer having a hidden Toshiba partition conflicted with the start-up recovery and i was unable to access the computer that.
    Took Toshiba recovery disk to gain access, whatever occurred i should just like to mention approach using recovery manger with caution

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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Plumtree View Post
    I had a problem allowing Acronis True Image Home 2009 to make a partition on my C:\ and then by activating started up recovery manager on my Toshiba Vista Home Premium. The computer having a hidden Toshiba partition conflicted with the start-up recovery and i was unable to access the computer that.
    Took Toshiba recovery disk to gain access, whatever occurred i should just like to mention approach using recovery manger with caution
    Robert,
    Hello.. I had used TI 2009 , and had so many problems that i gave up and went back to version 11, which worked flawlessly. (now am using 2010) When you activate the "recovery manager" on any of the versions of TI that i have tried (11, 2009,2010) they will take away control at boot time. On my PC you hit "F11" to access the recovery partition (or used to) I have since removed the "recovery partition" as TI does a much better job recovering. There are ways around this if you want to .. You have to change the Acronis F11 command to something else... So you could still use your PC's recovery partition. (search Acronis forum http://forum.acronis.com/) for the details Regards Fred
    PlainFred

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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    One update: on my new Toshiba Satellite (64-bit Windows 7 Home Premium) I do not have to shut down anything to make backups with True Image 2010. CD and DVD burning also go off without any problems, even with everything up and running. I think this is due to the dual-core processor (actually, 4-way hyperthreading) which can handle background tasks and backup or burning operations without interference. So iBeme is right that on such modern computers, background processes are very unlikely to cause a failure in a backup operation, as happened in the original post of this thread.

    Nevertheless, I have limited Startups on my Toshiba. I want this computer to remain fast and agile as long as possible.

    However, if anyone does have a failure and changing vendors or versions does not resolve the issue, I still think about the fastest way to determine if there is some sort of software or driver conflict, is to try the backup operation in Windows Safe Mode. If it works there, the most likely cause of failure in Windows Normal Mode is some sort of conflict with a security product or a background process. Hence my advice to try doing a backup in Windows Safe Mode.

    Also, DO NOT activate the Acronis Secure Zone or Recovery Manager on any system with a Hidden Recovery Partition. As posted above, this often leads to conflicts at just the moment when you need the OEM Recovery Partition the most! A Secure Zone can be created on an external drive with no problems.
    -- Bob Primak --

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