Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37
  1. #1
    3 Star Lounger midnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Almost Deep East Texas
    Posts
    352
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts

    More on the system backup subject

    I think I have read most all the posts in the Lounge on backing up in Win7, including Fred Langa's article in this week's newsletter. In the discussions of installing Win 7SP1, and other updates, I have seen it said that someone does a System Image, does the install, and if it goes wrong, restores the system image. Well and good. Understand all that.

    My question is concerning how long a system image backup should take. I have a Seagate Free Agent external HD, 750 GB, My computer is a Lenovo H320, with 1 T HD, and the system image takes over an hour. It ends up at 49 Gb after compression.

    If this is normal, then okay, if not what can I do.

    BJ

  2. #2
    Super Moderator RetiredGeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Manning, South Carolina
    Posts
    9,436
    Thanks
    372
    Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,326 Posts
    BJ,

    The time it takes to create an image depends on several factors:
    1. How much of the 1 Tb drive is actually in use.
    2. What level of Compression is used.
    3. How much memory you have.
    4. How much processor power you have {Cores & MHz}
    5. The speed of the connection to the Free Agent drive {USB 1.0, 2.0, 3.0, Firewire, External SATA, or if NAS 100Mb or 1 GB}.
    6. What software you are using, e.g. Acronis True Image is much faster than the Builtin Windows Imaging.

    I'm sure someone will add something to this list that I forgot. The end result is that it is entirely dependent on your individual circumstances. As an example when I was using Acronis TI 11 it took me a couple of hours to backup and verify an image. upgrading to TI 2010 I can now do it in less than an hour on the same machine. Thus, I now do it more often...this is a good thing!
    May the Forces of good computing be with you!

    RG

    PowerShell & VBA Rule!

    My Systems: Desktop Specs
    Laptop Specs

  3. #3
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    12,631
    Thanks
    161
    Thanked 936 Times in 856 Posts
    My Images with Acronis (compressed size approx. 25 GB) takes approx. 25 minutes for Image and validation. To rstore from this Image takes less than 10 minutes.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  4. #4
    5 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    820
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 62 Times in 57 Posts
    I have a Seagate Free Agent Go external HD, 500 GB, with stand. The cable (without stand) is firewire to USB, and if I use the stand I have a pair of USB cables, both of which I connect to the computer. (This arrangement also provides a longer lead to the computer from the stand.)

    This is a reminder that your external drive does not have an independent power supply - it gets its juice from the computer via the USB cable, which also has to carry the data back and forth between the computer and the drive. You have all the mechanical work of running the drive with just the USB cable to make it spin and to light the pretty lights, and your computer, possibly running on battery, is providing the power for that. There is a maximum amount of power a USB can provide, or at least a maximum design limit for peripherals that run on it.

    It's a terrific drive, in my book, by the way, but with all the variables to consider you may not have thought of that. It's also possible that your model is much newer than mine, but if you have a pair of USB connectors, use them.

  5. #5
    Super Moderator CLiNT's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    California & Arizona
    Posts
    6,121
    Thanks
    160
    Thanked 609 Times in 557 Posts
    The best way to ensure that image restoration and creation is done in a timely maner is to separate out as much of your user data as possible from the operating system.
    And the best way to accomplish that would be to keep a well organized file system with key folders located off the primary operating system partition. Many folders in
    windows 7 can be moved to other locations appart from the operating system. Partitions are good, but extra internal drives are better.

    Having many MB's worth of photos, music, and documents scattered about the operating system and difficult to locate is inefficient and wastefull. Microsoft's solution was to create libraries, but this unfortunately, does little to separate data from the operating system and thus reduce the size if image creation.

    The concept of data backup goes far beyond just drive images and hard copy backups to external drives. A well organized file system negates the need for complicated search engines and resource hungry indexing, even system restore imo. With a well organized file system you will come to know exactly where your documents & files are located and be in a position to easily back them up independant of imaging.

    As far as I am concerned, operating system images of the primary drive are only a means of quickly restoring the os in the event of an os failure.
    Setting up you computer in such a way that renders the operating system as unimportant and expendable also goes a long way in dealing with security threats like viruses and malware.
    In my not so humble opinion, too many people with absolutely no or limited computer skills are fumbling around trying to find solutions to rid themselves of some irrelevant infection when it is completely unnecessary.

    20 to 30 minutes of computer downtime for an image restoration is all that should ever be needed in 99% of all situations.
    Last edited by CLiNT; 2011-05-14 at 02:15.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to CLiNT For This Useful Post:

    efemmeral (2011-05-23)

  7. #6
    3 Star Lounger midnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Almost Deep East Texas
    Posts
    352
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
    [QUOTE=CLiNT;801827]

    As far as I am concerned, operating system images of the primary drive are only a means of quickly restoring the os in the event of an os failure.

    That is my primary interest in doing the system image type of backup.

    In my not so humble opinion, too many people with absolutely no or limited computer skills are fumbling around trying to find solutions to rid themselves of some irrelevant infection when it is completely unnecessary.

    OUCH!


    Thanks to all of you for some good comments which I am going to address, individually.

    BJ

  8. #7
    3 Star Lounger midnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Almost Deep East Texas
    Posts
    352
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
    Thanks R. Geek

    Should have included these other factors..... less than 100Gb of the 1T HD is in use.
    Processor is i5, reading from sys info "Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i5 CPU 650 @ 3.20GHz, 3201 Mhz, 2 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s)"
    6 Gb memory
    Don't know the compression.... whatever Win7 does.
    Connection to the Seagate is USB 2.0.

    And the last question tells the tale: I am using the builtin Win7 program. Sounds like you, and some of the others do not agree with Fred Langa, "it's almost nutty not to do it"

    BJ

  9. #8
    3 Star Lounger midnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Almost Deep East Texas
    Posts
    352
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by dogberry View Post
    I have a Seagate Free Agent Go external HD, 500 GB, with stand. The cable (without stand) is firewire to USB, and if I use the stand I have a pair of USB cables, both of which I connect to the computer.
    ---snip----
    It's a terrific drive, in my book, by the way, but with all the variables to consider you may not have thought of that. It's also possible that your model is much newer than mine, but if you have a pair of USB connectors, use them.
    This pair of connectors does have me baffled...... must be something I am not seeing. Can you enlighten me?

    BJ

  10. #9
    Super Moderator RetiredGeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Manning, South Carolina
    Posts
    9,436
    Thanks
    372
    Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,326 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by midnight View Post
    Thanks R. Geek

    Should have included these other factors..... less than 100Gb of the 1T HD is in use.
    Processor is i5, reading from sys info "Processor Intel(R) Core(TM) i5 CPU 650 @ 3.20GHz, 3201 Mhz, 2 Core(s), 4 Logical Processor(s)"
    6 Gb memory
    Don't know the compression.... whatever Win7 does.
    Connection to the Seagate is USB 2.0.

    And the last question tells the tale: I am using the builtin Win7 program. Sounds like you, and some of the others do not agree with Fred Langa, "it's almost nutty not to do it"

    BJ
    BJ,

    With the processing power you have available I'd say the USB 2.0 is the bottle neck. That said your backup time still seems a might long for the amount of data you are actually backing up. I image about 60Gb and the whole thing including verification {which Windows Imaging does not do to the best of my knowledge} over a USB 2.0 connection takes well less than an hour with Acronis TI 2010.
    May the Forces of good computing be with you!

    RG

    PowerShell & VBA Rule!

    My Systems: Desktop Specs
    Laptop Specs

  11. #10
    3 Star Lounger midnight's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Almost Deep East Texas
    Posts
    352
    Thanks
    42
    Thanked 8 Times in 7 Posts
    Sooooo, I should have bought a drive with firewire connection! Absent that, I am researching prices on Acronis and find that a 3 pack is quite reasonable right now (til May 31)

    Thanks for the beer.

    BJ

  12. #11
    Super Moderator RetiredGeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Manning, South Carolina
    Posts
    9,436
    Thanks
    372
    Thanked 1,457 Times in 1,326 Posts
    BJ & All,

    I got wrapped up with this and thought I should check out my memory since I have a bad case of CRS.
    A full image of my machine {about 60 Gb in 3 Partitions} with True Image 2010 using standard compression and verification took 55 minutes. This is using Win-7 64 Bit, Intel Core2 Quad Q6600 # 2.4GHz w/4 GB @400Mhz DDR2 PC-6400.

    However, this is still an order of magnitude faster than TI 11 {note: that is not 2011 but 11 before they went to year naming}.
    May the Forces of good computing be with you!

    RG

    PowerShell & VBA Rule!

    My Systems: Desktop Specs
    Laptop Specs

  13. #12
    Super Moderator bbearren's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Polk County, Florida
    Posts
    3,760
    Thanks
    26
    Thanked 424 Times in 338 Posts
    I was due for a backup, so I dedided to time the entire process like RetiredGeek did. I dual-boot Windows 7 Ultimate and Windows 7 Home Premium, and each installation is on three separate partitions/logical drives, which makes for a total of 6 drive images.

    I use BootIt Next Generation, I run an image/validation on each individual drive/partition (although BootITNG does allow for image sets) to an external eSATA drive dock with a 1TB drive, and the total time for all 6 was one hour sixteen minutes. 77.9GB was compressed to 24.9GB in the process.

    (BootIt Next Generation has been upgraded to BootIt Bare Metal, but I haven't upgraded yet.)
    Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!

    "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware.
    Unleash Windows

  14. #13
    5 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    820
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 62 Times in 57 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by midnight View Post
    This pair of connectors does have me baffled...... must be something I am not seeing. Can you enlighten me?

    BJ
    Here, from Wikipedia, is a description: “Some devices like high-speed external disk drives may require more than 500 mA of current and therefore cannot be powered from one USB 2.0 port. Such devices usually come with Y-shaped cable that has two USB connectors to be inserted into a computer. With such a cable a device can draw power from two USB ports simultaneously.”

    The stand for my Seagate provides a connection-pair, and it cost sixteen bucks. If you google “USB Y” you will find photos or illustrations. I was wrong to mention Firewire; I think the connection is micro USB.

    That is a specialized drive. It is a pocket portable and it requires no external power supply. It came with bundled software, and it was and is the cream of the crop. The software is updated and downloadable, and USB 2 is still the only game in town at the computer end. It is not a drive I would use for daily system backups, and if I did I would recognize the trade-offs.

    Patience is a virtue.

  15. The Following User Says Thank You to dogberry For This Useful Post:

    midnight (2011-05-17)

  16. #14
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    12,519
    Thanks
    152
    Thanked 1,398 Times in 1,221 Posts
    I would say that times really depend on the external hard drive, other than the amount of data. My desktop (190 GB) takes about an hour or so with TI 2010 and a USB 2.0 external drive. When backing up to the external e-sata drive, takes about 40 minutes or so.

    Backing up the laptop is much slower, comparatively, as it's around 60 GB and takes more or less the same time.

    Must time it next time I do it, as it seems my backups are way too fast when compared with what you have here.

  17. #15
    5 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    820
    Thanks
    16
    Thanked 62 Times in 57 Posts
    I don't believe the OP or I specified that the Seagate drive we are talking about is a 2-1/2" drive, not a 3-1/2", which is the standard that most users think of when talking about an external drive in an enclosure. What has been mentioned is that it does not have an independent power supply (it sucks the lifeblood out of your computer via the USB connector).

    There is a world of difference between that and something like a WD My Book, which is a common external 3-1/2" drive with power supply. Five hundred GB is still the normal max for a laptop's own drive, and these are external and highly portable drives, 500 GB in my case and 750 in his.

    I appear to be the only one with Acronis 2011 (plus) and I never time backups - I set them to shut the computer off when finished and do something else. I spent too many years feeding giant stacks of floppies into drives to get a backup to want to watch the silly thing do it for me.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •