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  1. #1
    Super Moderator jwitalka's Avatar
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    Win 8ís Metro isnít very good without touch, but that doesnít matter

    http://lifehacker.com/5842200/window...-really-matter

    What do you think the odds are that someone will strip out Metro from Win 8 along the lines of XP lite?

    Jerry

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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jwitalka View Post
    http://lifehacker.com/5842200/window...-really-matter

    What do you think the odds are that someone will strip out Metro from Win 8 along the lines of XP lite?

    Jerry
    "Someone" is Microsoft itself. The Metro Interface will not run x86 programs on ARM architecture, thus making it necessary for all legacy software on these tablets and low-end PCs to run without the Metro interface. Given this limitation alone, the demos seen so far show the need to make the traditional Desktop Interface available at least to business and professional version users.

    On AMD and Intel hardware, the processing power is there to run x86, x64 and Metro Apps. So the Desktop seems not to be going away anytime soon. However, the Tablet, Home Premium, Professional and Enterprise versions of Win8 may be very different in this respect. So we will have to choose carefully which version we use when upgrading existing laptops especially. Some versions may include the Desktop while others may not.

    The demos I've seen so far usually show applications running on both interfaces. We shall see what the actual RTM Release includes sometime next year. Until then, we are only speculating, and that isn't very productive -- although it can be fun.
    -- Bob Primak --

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    There is some confusion about what will and won't run on various devices under Windows 8. The traditional Windows desktop will be available on ARM machines just as in the demos we've seen. X86 programs will NOT run as is on an ARM device. At a minimum the software provider will have to recompile the program to run on an ARM machine. More likely is that there will need to be some changes made to the program for it to run on an ARM machine. See Windows 8 developer preview for a short Q&A.

    Joe

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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeP517 View Post
    There is some confusion about what will and won't run on various devices under Windows 8. The traditional Windows desktop will be available on ARM machines just as in the demos we've seen. X86 programs will NOT run as is on an ARM device. At a minimum the software provider will have to recompile the program to run on an ARM machine. More likely is that there will need to be some changes made to the program for it to run on an ARM machine. See Windows 8 developer preview for a short Q&A.

    Joe
    That's a fine distinction as far as I'm concerned. It does not change the limitations on ARM architecture with regards to full-scale Windows applications. I doubt that many developers would support an ARM laptop, for example, if it meant recompiling all their code bases. Buyer beware seems to be the order of the day. Kind of like buying a laptop with a SATA-2 hard drive and a Sandy Bridge Core-i5 or Core-i7 processor. Due to a known flaw in the processors (a bad transistor in some production runs) the drive will mysteriously fail just past the one-year or two-year hardware warranty period. And no SATA-2 replacement will run on the computer thereafter, because the feature is gone at the processor level. Nice work, Intel!

    I do not like to buy hardware which ships broken. It's an insult. And ARM ships broken as far as I'm concerned.
    Last edited by bobprimak; 2011-09-22 at 16:48.
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    Whether those of us used to an X86/X64 world want to admit it or not there is more than one CPU paradigm in the world. Apple is proving that you can sell quite a few non-X86 devices annually. To further muddy the waters, Intel is going to have an SOC (System on a chip) implementation which it claims will compete effectively with ARM. Microsoft is just doing what they believe the must to compete. As with anything "buyer beware".

    It should be interesting.

    Joe

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    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    All of those alternative chip designs are limited to mobile devices and embedded OSes. They are not designed for complete computers capable of running real applications. I like my computers to be complete and capable of doing more than check email and connect to the Web via a limited portal. I think most users will find a need for at least one full scale, general purpose computer for the foreseeable future.

    It would be a big and costly mistake for any company to pin its fortunes on the passing fads of the mobile device world. I trust Windows 8 is not the beginning of Microsoft's Big Mistake. Apple will fade into obscurity as soon as the Tablet fad fades, unless they continue to make full-scale computers and an OS to run on them. Apple seems to know this. I am not so sure about Microsoft after seeing the Win 8 demos.

    Mobile devices have their place, but it is not as a laptop replacement. And laptops are not workstation replacements. There is and should be more than one processor/platform and more than one OS vendor. (Not to mention Open Source for truly independent folks.) But one type of device should not be thought of as replacing the others.

    That assumption is what bothers me the most about Metro -- both the interface and the browser. The demos seem to be assuming that mobile devices are going to kill off laptops, and touchscreen enabled all in one desktops will replace workstations. Also, that paid and tightly controlled Apps will replace full-featured third-party programs. False, false and false. At least for the next few years.

    Metro seems (like Apple and Google) to be designed to lock out third-party and Open Source software and plug-ins. Check out the demos with this in mind and you can see the slow creep from a relatively open interface towards a total vendor lock-in. Not my idea of a bright future for personal computing.
    Last edited by bobprimak; 2011-09-24 at 03:52.
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    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    I have found that Win 8 works fine without touch capability. I am still getting accustomed to getting around in the OS, but if the Metro interface doesn't suit your needs, it can be disabled quite easily:

    To turn off Metro UI

    Method 1:

    C:\Windows\System32\shsxs.dll change file name to: shsxs.dll.old or simply shsxs.old

    Method 2:

    Using the registry method go to HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Software\Microsoft\Windows\Curre ntVersion\Explorer and modify RPEnabled to 0 where the default value is 1

    Both methods requires a reboot.

    I have tried editing the registry and changing the filename - from what I've experienced, editing the registry does bring back the original start menu, but also leaves the 'metro ui' intact, however, with smaller inactive icons/blocks/tabs/whatever you want to call them. Using the file name change, removes all 'metro ui' aspects, restores the original start menu - it's basically Windows 7 with new features - from what I've seen, the filename change doesn't do anything else but disable the metro ui completely... but with the registry entry leaving remnants, I'd suggest letting people know that the registry edit option may cause issues in some cases.

    In either case simply reverse the change you made to bring Win 8 Metro back.

    edit; See my link here for an even easier method.
    Last edited by Medico; 2011-09-24 at 06:57.
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    Shortcut for Metro Apps

    On desktop make new shortcut and for location copy/paste the following:
    %windir%\explorer.exe shell:::{4234d49b-0245-4df3-b780-3893943456e1}

    RMonroe

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  12. #9
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    So this places a shortcut to the Metro apps on your Desktop? I take it this shortcut might allow you to go directly to the All Apps page (for lack of the proper terminology this early am today) bypassing the Metro interface. I will have to explore this when I switch to Win 8 CP. This can then also be pinned to the taskbar. It might be easier to view it in alphabetical, list or detail form but nice tip.
    Last edited by Medico; 2012-03-02 at 05:03.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
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    Yup, it drops a shortcut to the Applications: see attached.

    Win 8 Applications.jpg

    Good, but could do with a lot more organisation in that folder display.

    Edit: Change the icon and pin it to the task bar as a "Start Menu".....

    pinned to Task Bar.JPG
    Last edited by Tinto Tech; 2012-03-02 at 06:51. Reason: Pinned to Task Bar

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    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Have to find a way to remember the settings for view and alphabetical when closing so when we reopen it opens with same view as when it closed.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


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  15. #12
    Super Moderator RetiredGeek's Avatar
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    TT,

    Where did you find that Icon?
    May the Forces of good computing be with you!

    RG

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    RG, Right click on the desktop icon, select Properties.

    Then as per attachment:

    Change Icon.JPG

    Select Change Icon and in the change icon window you should have the Start Menu icon I found. Alternatively you could make an .ico file using some freeware,

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    Super Moderator RetiredGeek's Avatar
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    TT,

    Thanks. For some reason when I changed the Icon the 1st time it didn't come up with the Explorer.exe icons but the Shell icons.
    May the Forces of good computing be with you!

    RG

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    I have found that Win 8 works fine without touch capability. I am still getting accustomed to getting around in the OS, but if the Metro interface doesn't suit your needs, it can be disabled quite easily:
    The two methods cited worked on the developer preview, but do not work on the consumer preview. Apparently MS wants to force us to "change".
    Chuck

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