Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 20
  1. #1
    Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Daytona Beach, Florida
    Posts
    62
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Is it safe to install SP1 as a standalone?

    is it safe to install SP1 as a stand alone and is there any precautions to worry about?

  2. #2
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    12,631
    Thanks
    161
    Thanked 936 Times in 856 Posts
    Go ahead and install SP1 as a stand alone. In fact I prefer this method and did it to all my Win 7 PC'es.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Medico For This Useful Post:

    rmonroe36 (2012-02-13)

  4. #3
    Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Daytona Beach, Florida
    Posts
    62
    Thanks
    2
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
    Thanks Ted for your reply, I had to format and everything is in place except for the sp1

  5. #4
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    St Louis, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    23,572
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 1,057 Times in 926 Posts
    It is always best to perform a complete system backup before installing a major update such as a service pack.

    Joe

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to JoeP517 For This Useful Post:

    rmonroe36 (2012-02-13)

  7. #5
    Gold Lounger
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Johnson City, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    3,202
    Thanks
    37
    Thanked 215 Times in 202 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by qwest View Post
    is it safe to install SP1 as a stand alone and is there any precautions to worry about?
    quest,
    Hello....There are a lot of "depends" on that question...

    1. What is the reason that you want to install "SP"s" ? Is something not working? ( at all, or incorrectly)

    2. Is there some perceived "Security" issue?

    3. Do you want to have the most up-to-date OS? or some other reason.

    Here is a (somewhat) different perspective ...from someone who has (on some of my OS's) no patches, updates, or "Service Packs".....My 2¢

    If you have a good "Security Paradigm" and web surfing habits...and your OS is all working,.... and your not collaborating with NASA in "Space missions" ...and just a everyday common user. Your just going to shoot yourself in the foot.... (applying Patches and Updates) My opinion and nothing to do with W.S. Lounge... there is no point to "Patch" a working OS.. If you keep doing this eventually you will break something.. If you use and trust your security ....What is the point ...are you going to make something better than ...It's working?.. I understand that my "paradigm" is not even close to "main stream" ...But... it has worked for me since Vista ... (actually XP but it came with SP-3 but nothing further patch wise) I have OS's that had all Patches and Updates ... and compared them against the ones without ... Not much, other than the bloat from continuous patching....and occasional breaking of something...Once again ... Unless there is some pressing reason ( like some program wont run) what's the point?... Helmet a-fixed ..Let the screaming begin Regards Fred
    Last edited by Just Plain Fred; 2012-02-12 at 16:48.
    PlainFred

    None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free (J. W. Von Goethe)

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Just Plain Fred For This Useful Post:

    rmonroe36 (2012-02-13)

  9. #6
    Lounge VIP
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    1,168
    Thanks
    44
    Thanked 134 Times in 115 Posts
    @ JPF: it's a valid opinion and nobody should scream and shout about that, certainly not with any reason anyway.

    For example, in a commercial environment you would be mad just to wade in and install every patch available. Breaking the ability to email Great Aunt Mable on your home PC is one thing, but breaking the company database is quite another!

    However.....(you just knew this was coming didn't you!)...

    Updates are not necessarily just for system security: they can (and do) add features and functions previously not available. They can make things work better (faster, more integrated, etc...). So the best thing to do is to review the fit, form and function for each update and decide if it's needed, or otherwise.

    Additionally, there are some Windows updates that patch critical flaws that would otherwise be exploited even with antivirus and safe browsing. One wouldn't expect eBay to be pedaling malicious code, but last year they were in fact the victim of malvertising and I cleaned several machines over the course of a weekend that had a drive-by infection injected by a flash animation being rendered from that site. They all had up to date AV.

    So, it's not just Windows Updates that need consideration - think Adobe Flash Player, Reader and Java. These are still among the most dangerous infection routes at present.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Tinto Tech For This Useful Post:

    rmonroe36 (2012-02-13)

  11. #7
    mart44
    Guest
    Microsoft designed/created the OS, so I'd say they know the complexities of it far better than I do. If they think patches and service pack are beneficial, I'm inclined to believe them. I'm in a home environment and have always installed patches and service packs as they have been made available. Done that since Windows 95 with no problems I can think of.

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to mart44 For This Useful Post:

    rmonroe36 (2012-02-13)

  13. #8
    4 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Fishkill, New York, USA
    Posts
    435
    Thanks
    96
    Thanked 35 Times in 31 Posts
    JPF, whenever I see your helmet appear, I make sure I read your advice/comments. The short and sweet of it is the old saw: "If it ain't broken - don't fix it". Tinto Tech makes valid points also. And then there is the Newsletter's Susan Bradley with Patch Watch. I could spend hours overall deciding which update to install, wait or bypass. My accommodation is to have a good backup procedure (like Ted Myers has often advised in this forum) and let the patches be installed. Yes, my computer is a little bloated but no serious belching has been noticed and if it does I have "MyAcronis" to back me up! Cheers to all of you!
    Last edited by rmonroe36; 2012-02-13 at 08:04.

  14. #9
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    St Louis, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    23,572
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 1,057 Times in 926 Posts
    The "if it ain't broken - don't fix it" argument when it comes to patching PCs drives me nuts. The point of any patch is that something is broken. Would you ignore a recall notice from an automobile manufacturer? You could as you may not see the problem. But the problem is still there. Ignore it at your own risk as JPF has chosen to do. But, as Tinto Tech noted often patches fix something that can be exploited even though you take good precautions. He is also correct in that a "best practive" is to evaluate all the patches before installing them. Unfortunately, that is not practical for most normal users. They have neither the background nor the inclination to do the required homework to make a really informed decision.

    I literally can count on one hand the number of problems I've ever had with updates on PCs at home, at work, at friends, and at family members over a couple of decades.

    Joe

  15. #10
    5 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Milwaukee, WI
    Posts
    737
    Thanks
    23
    Thanked 64 Times in 52 Posts
    There was a time when Windows users (both individual and corporate IT shops) were very wise to scrutinize every patch and service pack. Many of them were buggy and caused more problems then they solved. Since at least Win 2000 SP1 and Windows XP SP2 I have found that concern over patches is no longer worth wasting time over. Install them shortly after release and move on. If one chooses not to, that's a personal call. but as Joe said, its a bit like ignoring a recall on your car. I have found that if a system feels "bloated" after installing a SP, it probably wasn't healthy to begin with. The way to test that "bloat" idea is to install a fresh copy of Windows, install nothing else. Do a few "benchmark" perofrmance tests. Install the service pack. Do the tests. You won't see a performance difference.

    For security patches, I don't hesitate to install them, either at home, or at work.

    Service packs are never critical. I always wait a bit to see what I read on the Internet. While I respect everyone's knowledge and experience here, I generally ignore what I read about bad experiences with SPs from one or two individuals, either here or elsewhere. That's anecdotal evidence in the grand scheme of things. I look to the major tech news outlets and watch they are reporting en masse about the tech world's service pack issues. We've been running SP1 on Win 7 on about 1/3 of our PCs for a while at work without issues. I'm not convinced there is a compelling reason for a home user to jump on it, but it certainly is not going to cause any problems either. Always treat service packs like an operating system upgrade, because that's essentially what they are. So that means get a good backup (an image is best), and backup the system state as well.
    Last edited by Doc Brown; 2012-02-13 at 10:46.
    Chuck

  16. #11
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    12,631
    Thanks
    161
    Thanked 936 Times in 856 Posts
    As we have often advocated, even previously in this thread, you can create an image prior to installing patches, even small patches in case something does break, but as Joe states, my own experience is that I have not had patches break things. The original question was regarding SP1. In the case of major updates such as this, I always download the file seperately from WU, disconnect from the internet, shut down all running apps, including all security apps, then run the exe file to install the patch, after creating an image of course. If you follow the MS recommendations, they do advise to shut down all running apps prior to installing updates. In my experiences, running security apps can and do create problems during installations. These problems can occur during installation of apps as well as updates. I would be willing to bet that many of the problems experienced by people are because they do not follow this advice.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  17. #12
    Silver Lounger
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Montréal
    Posts
    1,795
    Thanks
    33
    Thanked 52 Times in 51 Posts
    A FWIW ! Just for fun, I have accepted ALL updates, in spite of Bradley. I never had to regret it. I say just for fun 'cuze I have clones and if push came to shove, I could clone back. Never had to.

  18. #13
    Silver Lounger
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Montréal
    Posts
    1,795
    Thanks
    33
    Thanked 52 Times in 51 Posts
    A FWIW !  Just for fun, I have accepted ALL updates, in spite of Bradley. I never had to regret it.  I say just for fun 'cuze I have clones and if push came to shove, I could clone back. Never had to.

  19. #14
    Gold Lounger
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Johnson City, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    3,202
    Thanks
    37
    Thanked 215 Times in 202 Posts
    Quote Originally Posted by JoeP517 View Post
    The "if it ain't broken - don't fix it" argument when it comes to patching PCs drives me nuts. The point of any patch is that something is broken. Would you ignore a recall notice from an automobile manufacturer?
    Joe,
    Hello...The automobile analogy is not relevant to PC's. If your OS is "Up and Running" with all programs ,and is stable...means just that ...you don't need to fix something that isn't broken ...Hoping that somehow it will be "better" than ....It's working. PC's that are working don't require the same type of maintenance as automobiles.... Other than blowing the dust out once in a while..and making sure the connections are tight. Sure sometimes they require repair because a power supply gave up or some component failed ... But the word is....Failed... (using your "Auto" analogy, recall or other) You get your car back and all is well .....except now your radio only plays "Cuban Salsa" music...Look I have OS's that i have run for years without one patch or update from MS, and i use my own blend of non MS security. The up side is that i never have to be concerned with "Patch Tuesday" .....ever. (a good thing).. Just my twisted opinion coming up here .... I think that for the most part that this never ending barage of "Patches to fix Patches" is mostly a clever MS marketing ploy ...(Keeps the consumer engaged..."old tactic") ."An exploit that could cause your computer to be taken over...Blah ,Blah, Blah,"The same drone month after month, year after year ... OK the bottom line. How do you explain that i have several OS's and use them all every week (as the mood strikes) That don't have any MS Patches\ Updates ? and are stable (run all my programs) and have never been the victim of "Security Problems"?...Either I'm the luckiest PC user alive ...or just "Dumb Luck"....or perhaps there is something else afoot ...."Just sayin"

    PS: Standard Disclaimer..... These opinions are mine and mine alone ...and have nothing whatsoever to do with W.S. Lounge.. and my "Doc" says that I'm making some progress
    PlainFred

    None are so hopelessly enslaved as those who falsely believe they are free (J. W. Von Goethe)

  20. #15
    Administrator
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    St Louis, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    23,572
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 1,057 Times in 926 Posts
    @Fred, I believe the analogy is relevant. A recall may be for an issues that is not apparent on all cars but is important to be repaired. You car can be running just fine and stable. You may never have the problem associated with the recall. Yet, most people will have the car "fixed" even though "it is not broken" convinced that they will not ever see the problem after the repair. You certainly may be replacing a component that has not yet failed.

    I believe what you have stated many times about running various OSes with nary a patch applied. I also believe that most of the active posters, VIPs, & Moderators at this site are much more attuned to the bad things that can happen to a PC than the average user and have developed advanced defense mechanisms. Just because you have never had a problem that has been resolved by a patch does not mean the problem does not exist. I do not believe that Microsoft or any other vendor is going to waste valuable developer resources fixing non-existent problems.

    BTW, it is not just Microsoft. Adobe is on a regular schedule to release patches. Apple pretty much does what it pleases but still releases patches with some regularity.

    Joe

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •