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  1. #1
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    IE8 does not work at all. What did I do wrong.

    Major mistake. Updated IE6 to IE8 on my winxp pro sp2 after updating it to sp3
    Had to update SPs after getting a vff.exe infection so as to get microsoft tools to work and check/clean my PC.

    Anyway, after updating to SP3 on xppro, downloaded from ms site IE8 and installed it.
    Did the immediate restart and it seemed to do a fuller install after checking for security problems and deleting any old IE versions etc.

    Try to start IE8 and norton pops up asking if I want it to check for phishing for me. Tell it no.
    Then IE dies and disappears.

    I prefer firefox but my wife likes IE -- go figure -- even though it is much slower and has less capability.

    So, any tips for what I need to do to get IE8 running.

    If I can find IE6 at microsoft I would be willing to rip out IE8 with uninstaller and then go back to IE6.
    But would that work? Or did the sp3 updates do somethign that needs changing first.

    Fortunately I had firefox or I would not be able to access the internet to DL anything after IE did a hard fail on me.

  2. #2
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    If you uninstall IE8 it should automatically revert to the previous version.

    Have you checked the Event Logs for errors?

    Joe

  3. #3
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    thanks
    did not check event log yet but will do so now

    no errors were reported during install

    i took from the ie8 install messages where it said it was removing old ie versions that that meant they were erased first

    norton never asked about being my phishing guardian before so that seems strange too

  4. #4
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    I'd download a fresh copy from IE8 for XP, uninstall IE8, re-boot, and then re-install using your new download.

    Joe

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeP517 View Post
    I'd download a fresh copy from IE8 for XP, uninstall IE8, re-boot, and then re-install using your new download.

    Joe
    thanks
    will try that next

  6. #6
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    When you do the reinstall, disconnect from the internet, shutdown as many apps as you can, including all your security apps, as recommended by MS, then do the install. MS and many other developers recommend closing down running apps prior to installing new apps so there is no chance of interference during the install.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    When you do the reinstall, disconnect from the internet, shutdown as many apps as you can, including all your security apps, as recommended by MS, then do the install. MS and many other developers recommend closing down running apps prior to installing new apps so there is no chance of interference during the install.

    thanks for that idea.

    i shut down everything but my security. if it fails again then i will have to try doing that too,
    but only after i do a full backup of everything first including the cloning of the main HD.

    am I paranoid?
    well, i do know they are out to get me. and they have a few times.
    [anyone remember cool web search (CWS) that took special removal software to rip it out with?]
    but they don't get to me as often as most other people that i know.
    that is why i keep my pc locked down as tight as possible.

    if hotmail did not require javacrap i don't think that any scumware could get me again.
    i block flash, activex, turn off html in email, yada yada.
    only way in that i have heard about is java, and my security software lets me know when that happens
    and usually fixes it for me. worst case, i can fix the problem manually like i did with a recent vff.exe attack.

    so turning any security software off is something i would do reluctantly.

    anyway, it does seem to relate to norton because that is the only time that phishing help message comes up from norton.
    so i may brave it and turn off norton but leave the other protection running.

    another clue. clicked on a link in my email (eudora) that insists on using IE instead of firefox. and IE worked then!
    I always copy the link into firefox to continue because IE is so sllooowwwwww and not as easy to use.
    but at least I got the link this time.

    getting eudora to use firefox directly will be another problem for a later day as it is low on my list of priorities.

  8. #8
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    You don't have to clone, takes a lot of space. Just make an Image (You should be making Images regularly anyway, cheap insurance). Save the Image to an Ext HD then go for it.

    I am paranoid as well. I always clean everything out from all temp stuff every day, keep everything up to date, make new Images regularly, have both S/W and H/W firewalls.

    If you have disconnected from the internet as I suggest first and foremost, then turning off your security apps during the install should present no problems. Just ensure the security apps are turned back on before reconnecting to the internet. I lost faith in Norton many years ago. Haven't used them for years, almost since Peter Norton sold out to Symantec. I now use MSE and am very happy with it.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    You don't have to clone, takes a lot of space. Just make an Image (You should be making Images regularly anyway, cheap insurance). Save the Image to an Ext HD then go for it.

    I am paranoid as well. I always clean everything out from all temp stuff every day, keep everything up to date, make new Images regularly, have both S/W and H/W firewalls.

    If you have disconnected from the internet as I suggest first and foremost, then turning off your security apps during the install should present no problems. Just ensure the security apps are turned back on before reconnecting to the internet. I lost faith in Norton many years ago. Haven't used them for years, almost since Peter Norton sold out to Symantec. I now use MSE and am very happy with it.
    thanks
    will look at that

    not sure how to clone on ext hd and replace it on the original
    dont the boot sectors and some other system files have to be in a specific place
    i am guessing there is a special program to do it as backup/restore programs do not do everything

    so - any suggestion how to do that image ?

    as to norton
    it has never been 100% but it does useful things.
    norton PLUS other programs makes a near complete security approach
    as near as possible with a system liek pc with win os



    It *is* possible to *architect* and design a 100% scumware proof pc.
    I did that back in the DOS days. But nobody would pay for it.
    Could do it for a windows type graphic style interface pc too. But not unless somebody pays for it up front.

    With reports of corporate databases being hacked on a regular basis and other countries hacking into DoD and other classified data why doesn't the government or a corporate consortium fund the development of a totally scumware proof pc ?

    If it is **architected** into the hard/soft wares it can be done. There is no way to tack on security after the fact. And AV software will always be behind the power curve trying t oatch up to the hackers methods.

  10. #10
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Just read through many of the threads in the Security and Back up forum. There are many discussions on Imaging. I do not use cloning so I cannot discuss this. My knowledge of cloning is that both HDs are connected together and and the first HD is copied bit by bit to the second HD. The clone is identically sized to the original HD. Imaging involves creating a single compressed file holding the contents of one or more partitions on a HD. This file takes up far less space than the original size of the HD but is not bootable without using the app it was created with. The Imaging app is used to boot a PC and the Image file is used to restore the HD as it was when the file was created.

    I create a new Image at least once per month and often more regularly than that. This way if something bad happens my Image is very UpTo Date so it only take me about 10 minutes to restore my HD back to where it was when the Image was created. Think of Images this way. When you purchase a new PC the PC manufacturer loads an Image onto the HD from an Image they created perhaps several months before. They probably use that same Image to load hundreds of PCes. That's why when we buy a new PC we have to update Windows as soon as we get it. The Image is out of date.

    I store my Images on an Ext USB HD. I can store dozens of Images on this Ext HD. I can take my Image back to sevral different states if I so desire.

    The exact method of creating an Image is entirely dependent on the app you choose to create the Image. Many excellent apps are discussed in the Security and Backup Forum.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


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  11. #11
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    To answer the second part of your question, it is difficult to design a "scumproof" PC. First the scum is constantly is flux. What is "scumproof" today may be inadequate tomorrow. Secondly, it is impossible to provide proof against the worst offender, the user themself. What are their surfing habits, do they blindly click on pop up boxes, do they blindly open attachments, do they surf sites that are less than upright, do they spend any time on their security?

    A good security system should be multilayered, at least mine is. I have what I believe is a good AV/AM app (MSE) which is kept up to date running in real time, I have a couple of AM apps (MalwareBytes and Spybot Search and Destroy) which I regularly run manual scans with, a good S/W firewall (Online Armor) and a H/W firewall in my router. I routinely clean my system. These are the things I do.
    Last edited by Medico; 2012-02-24 at 19:05.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    To answer the second part of your question, it is difficult to design a "scumproof" PC. First the scum is constantly is flux. What is "scumproof" today may be inadequate tomorrow. Secondly, it is impossible to provide proof against the worst offender, the user themself. What sre their surfing habits, do they blindly click on pop up boxes, do they blindly open attachments, do they surf sites that are less than upright, do they spend any time on their security?

    A good security system should be multilayered, at least mine is. I have what I believe is a good AV/AM app (MSE) which is kept up to date running in real time, I have a couple of AM apps (MalwareBytes and Spybot Search and Destroy) which I regularly run manual scans with, a good S/W firewall (Online Armor) and a H/W firewall in my router. I routinely clean my system. These are the things I do.
    i will respectfully disagree

    it may be difficult if you do not understand how to do it but not so hard if you do --
    not fully analagous but doing brain surgery without medical school first is hard
    a trained physician with knowledge/experience with the brain and surgery can do aaamazing things

    but if one has been trained in SYSTEMS THEORY, and related topics like systems thinking, SYSTEMS ARCHITECTURE, systems analysis, and systems design AND has some domain knowledge then it is straightforward to do.

    clearly it takes some effort but every significant project takes effort.

    the only real problem is WILL. both politically and financially.
    people never want to pay for security. they only react after the fact when forced to.
    look at all the companies that got hacked and just hushed it up instead of doing anything.

    as i noted , i did this (designed a scumware pc) for dos in the 1980 time frame.
    and so did the USAF on a contract with a minor beltway bandit.
    nobody would buy them.

    i can do it for win type machines but not until somebody is willing to pay up front this time.

    yes threats are changing which is why adding on fixes to win and intel chip machines fails.

    but you can *systems* **architect** and then design a provable scumware totally secure pc that is oblivious to all threats no matter how they change.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    Just read through many of the threads in the Security and Back up forum. There are many discussions on Imaging. I do not use cloning so I cannot discuss this. My knowledge of cloning is that both HDs are connected together and and the first HD is copied bit by bit to the second HD. The clone is identically sized to the original HD. Imaging involves creating a single compressed file holding the contents of one or more partitions on a HD. This file takes up far less space than the original size of the HD but is not bootable without using the app it was created with. The Imaging app is used to boot a PC and the Image file is used to restore the HD as it was when the file was created.

    I create a new Image at least once per month and often more regularly than that. This way if something bad happens my Image is very UpTo Date so it only take me about 10 minutes to restore my HD back to where it was when the Image was created. Think of Images this way. When you purchase a new PC the PC manufacturer loads an Image onto the HD from an Image they created perhaps several months before. They probably use that same Image to load hundreds of PCes. That's why when we buy a new PC we have to update Windows as soon as we get it. The Image is out of date.

    I store my Images on an Ext USB HD. I can store dozens of Images on this Ext HD. I can take my Image back to sevral different states if I so desire.

    The exact method of creating an Image is entirely dependent on the app you choose to create the Image. Many excellent apps are discussed in the Security and Backup Forum.
    thanks

    i will have to read about imaging again.
    my impression was that while imaging saved and restored a lot, it did not restore everything and that is why cloning was required. i.e. boot sector problems and rootkits would not be eliminated with an image restore.

  14. #14
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Imaging is like a photo of the ENTIRE HD including everything, all apps, all customizations, placement of apps, everything. It is included in one compressed file and works very well. Cloning is similar except it is not compressed and both HDs have to be connected at the same time. You then transfer the HD from one to the other. Like I said all manufacturers use Imaging. For example, my granddaughter's new PC arrived yesterday. Right out of the box there were 40 updates from Microsoft because the Image Dell used was probably 2 or 3 months out of date. What they do is buy numerous licenses and use the same image with a different license for each PC. Easy! You essentially do the same thing except you update your PC, customize it the way you want it, add and remove the apps you want, then create an Image. Then if something bad happens, it takes you 10 minutes to restore that Image to your PC. just remember you have to create a Boot Media one time only with your Imaging app. My Acronis True Image Home has a Boot Media that fits on a CD. I slip the CD in, boot to it, attach my Ext HD that has my Images and Recover my Image. it's that easy.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


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    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Myers View Post
    Imaging is like a photo of the ENTIRE HD including everything, all apps, all customizations, placement of apps, everything. It is included in one compressed file and works very well. Cloning is similar except it is not compressed and both HDs have to be connected at the same time. You then transfer the HD from one to the other. Like I said all manufacturers use Imaging. For example, my granddaughter's new PC arrived yesterday. Right out of the box there were 40 updates from Microsoft because the Image Dell used was probably 2 or 3 months out of date. What they do is buy numerous licenses and use the same image with a different license for each PC. Easy! You essentially do the same thing except you update your PC, customize it the way you want it, add and remove the apps you want, then create an Image. Then if something bad happens, it takes you 10 minutes to restore that Image to your PC. just remember you have to create a Boot Media one time only with your Imaging app. My Acronis True Image Home has a Boot Media that fits on a CD. I slip the CD in, boot to it, attach my Ext HD that has my Images and Recover my Image. it's that easy.
    thanks for that elaboration

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