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  1. #1
    5 Star Lounger
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    Windows Secrets special issue on Windows 8




    INTRODUCTION

    Windows Secrets special issue on Windows 8


    By Tracey Capen

    Well, it's here. The most controversial version of Windows ever released is out in new PCs and as an upgrade. We won't predict the success or failure of Windows 8 (there is no shortage of tech pundits who have), but we will provide lots of helpful information on how to get started exploring the new OS.

    The full text of this column is posted at WindowsSecrets.com/introduction/windows-secrets-special-issue-on-windows-8/ (opens in a new window/tab).

    Columnists typically cannot reply to comments here, but do incorporate the best tips into future columns.

  2. #2
    Super Moderator CLiNT's Avatar
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    It's been a mixed bag for me, I've had exactly two days so far of experience on it and I have a bit of a headache right now.
    [Windows 8 Pro with non upgrade install disk purchased from the MS store and shipped to me]
    I don't like upgrade installations of any type and will purposely go out of my way to pay more for a full install
    disk of a pro flavor.

    The many articles and work around's that Medico and others have provided here on the lounge truly are a decent source
    of information, almost a one stop shop. Thanks guys. For the most part all I had to do was come here.

    My install was pretty easy and painless, and didn't take nearly as long as Windows 7 does. Although I'm an ardent believer of the clean
    install, Windows 8 has the best chance, imo, to produce a more trouble free upgrade install than any prior OS.
    The upgrade assistant too provided valuable information on driver support, but not completely. Many worked flawlessly without a mention
    and were transferred over for the previous W7 setup.
    So I did the "remove everything and reinstall Windows" install directly from the DVD while running W7.
    It went very well and I ended up with a very stable OS. It did however leave a 24GB windows.old folder. I also noted some
    transferring of specialty drivers from the old system to the new, so not a true clean install, but very workable.

    After fiddling and fudging around in it for a while I decided to try a more thorough format and clean install. That too didn't
    take long to perform. But be careful, WU wants to find drivers for you.

    The "Modern UI" start screen is getting a bit easier to deal with on a desktop with my (below) specs, but the apps are just too ridiculously simple.
    Too simple to actually use to get any real work done, they're intended for weaker portable devices. [that's exactly what they are]

    As far as looks go, I find I'm missing the aero glass from W7 quite a bit.
    Without a start button I'm finding myself going to program root directories to get shortcuts placed. I've ended up
    feeling a very strong need to use one of the many start button emulators. I may decide to remove it after everything is setup to my liking.
    It'll be quite a bit of work getting shortcuts of programs to your desktop and task bar worked out after a fresh install.
    Something a noobie will undoubtedly have some difficulty with. [But]
    The modern UI interface has all of your installed programs located on the start screen just hidden with a single click and scroll.
    This is what they look like:
    Untitled.jpg
    More like a mish-mash of programs, readme files, & uninstallers etc.
    all flung together.


    IE10 is a bit of a question mark too. I'm not sure if it's 32 bit or 64 bit defaulted. The icon on the taskbar tracks back to the Programs folder, as
    opposed to the programs x86 folder, where incidentally, there is a copy of IE10 as well. I would assume that is the 32 bit version.
    "Help-about IE", provides little info as to the bit rate of IE you are running.
    Question: Has MS defaulted IE to the 64 bit version in 64 bit OS installations.
    The spell checker in IE10 is a sweet feature too, I'm using it while I write this.

    Highly usable but it also has the feel of not being finished.

    It's definitely a work in progress.
    Last edited by CLiNT; 2012-11-01 at 00:54.
    DRIVE IMAGING
    Invest a little time and energy in a well thought out BACKUP regimen and you will have minimal down time, and headache.

    Build your own system; get everything you want and nothing you don't.
    Latest Build:
    ASUS X99 Deluxe, Core i7-5960X, Corsair Hydro H100i, Plextor M6e 256GB M.2 SSD, Corsair DOMINATOR Platinum 32GB DDR4@2666, W8.1 64 bit,
    EVGA GTX980, Seasonic PLATINUM-1000W PSU, MountainMods U2-UFO Case, and 7 other internal drives.

  3. #3
    New Lounger pszwarc's Avatar
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    I've just read Tracey's comments on Windows 8 in the newsletter. While Win8 is undoubtedly a nice progress as far as the underlying OS is concerned (faster boot, fewer running processes, less demand on hardware resources, better networking, ) I agree that the user interface is definitely unpleasant and cumbersome for someone who, like me, has been using a GUI since Windows 3.x days, and a computer since punched cards and/or tape (I first used a computer in 1966). Using hover motions instead of the familiar Start button/menu combination will put off quite a few people, and having to learn a whole new environment is going to cost millions in retraining. The new start screen can be rearranged to one's tastes, but there is no provision at all for 2nd- and higher-level tiles, whereas the Start menu could be organized into folders and sub-folders to reduce the jumble. The more apps you have pinned to the start screen, the more difficult it's going to be to find anything specific without having to use the search facility. They may call it "modern" UI, but it is really reminiscent of AOL's first graphical interface in the 1990's
    Last edited by pszwarc; 2012-11-01 at 06:12.

  4. #4
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Clint, I set IE 10 to always open in the desktop version. I do use LastPass and the Modern/Metro/Win 8 version does not allow these add-ons. I believe I did show this in my Tutorial, but just to show it again:

    AlwaysIEDesktop.jpg

    I have the same feeling about the Win 8 Apps. I have stated, and still think that the Modern /Win 8 Style UI is more for play time at present. They are just too basic for those needing to do real work on their PC's. I have to believe this will change over time, but for now, just let me go to the desktop.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  5. #5
    New Lounger
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    need assitance
    as in the topic Windows Secrets special issue on Windows 8
    it was written
    The good news is that setting up and exploring Windows 8 is relatively cheap and easy. You can buy five upgrade licenses for $40. The official site states that you can upgrade from XP, Vista, or Win7.

    I need to know wether in 40$ there is one license or 5. Plz clarify
    Thanx in advance

  6. #6
    Super Moderator jwitalka's Avatar
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    The $40 license is for one computer. Not sure what the article was referring to unless there is a maximum number of $40 licenses per household that I am not aware of.

    Jerry

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    Super Moderator CLiNT's Avatar
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    Windows 8 is seriously locked down.
    If you thought you were experiencing issues with permissions in windows 7, Windows 8 takes it to new heights.
    It may be good security for the average Joe, but it's hell when one needs to run odd programs that do not follow
    the normal install routines, like batch installed components that were written 10 years ago.
    An example;
    In order to get VirtualDubMod to recognize outputted files from VFAPIConv I had to manually add registry entries in order
    to get VFAPIConv's dlls registered and communicating with each other to run and work properly.
    This is something a simple batch script would have handled in previous OS's easily with one click.
    It took me hours to figure this out and get these apps working.


    You'll find that the admin account in Windows 8 is even more restricted than the admin account in Windows 7.
    I'll be looking for workarounds for many things I suspect.

    Incidentally, VirtualDubMod & VFAPIConv, along with NanDub are some of the more ancient programs around
    for DVD conversion. I was surprised it took so much effort to get these working together, but they are.
    Last edited by CLiNT; 2012-11-01 at 12:08.
    DRIVE IMAGING
    Invest a little time and energy in a well thought out BACKUP regimen and you will have minimal down time, and headache.

    Build your own system; get everything you want and nothing you don't.
    Latest Build:
    ASUS X99 Deluxe, Core i7-5960X, Corsair Hydro H100i, Plextor M6e 256GB M.2 SSD, Corsair DOMINATOR Platinum 32GB DDR4@2666, W8.1 64 bit,
    EVGA GTX980, Seasonic PLATINUM-1000W PSU, MountainMods U2-UFO Case, and 7 other internal drives.

  8. #8
    New Lounger pszwarc's Avatar
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    Unhappy

    Microsoft is going down the same road as Apple : they don't want you to use programs that didn't come through the Windows Market, so they're making it as difficult as they can. I wouldn't be at all surprised that Windows 9 doesn't support the destktop any longer. Fortunately, by the time this happens I'll have retired and will be able to switch to Linux…

  9. #9
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Not true. Clint is talking about very old S/W that he uses. 10 years in computer age is quite old. Most apps developed in the last few years either work quite nicely or have been updated to work quite nicely.

    Yes in the Win 8 UI, you have to obtain your apps from the Win 8 App Store. In the Desktop UI almost every app that runs on Win 7 will run equally well on Win 8 Pro. Many apps that run on XP also run on Win 8 Pro.

    We have had discussion on the desktop before. In fact there is one thread on just this subject. Bottom line is that many of us feel the desktop will be around for a long time to come.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

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    Star Lounger
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    Hello ~ Ms. Capen,
    I too, am running the preview of win 8 in virtual box. I noticed you are doing the same, is it the real version or the preview?
    I couldn't find a way to buy/upgrade to win 8 pro, as advertised!? How did you do it?
    Thanks for your information.
    a subscriber to WS from the beginning.

  11. #11
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    I believe you need to use the Full Install, OEM version of Win 8 Pro to install in a VM. Sorry, the lower priced Upgrade version will not work.

    There is some contradictory information on this subject:


    Can I legally install Windows 8 in a virtual machine?
    Yes. You can install any version of Windows 8 in a virtual machine, using virtualization software on any platform. (If the VM is running a properly licensed copy of a recent Windows version, you can use the upgrade edition of Windows 8; in most circumstances, the PUL System Builder edition is the correct choice.)
    Note that you cannot share licenses between the host PC and a virtual instance. The following text appears in section 1(f):
    If you use virtualization software, including Client Hyper-V, to create one or more virtual computers on a single computer hardware system, each virtual computer, and the physical computer, is considered a separate computer for purposes of this agreement. This license allows you to install only one copy of the software for use on one computer, whether that computer is physical or virtual. If you want to use the software on more than one virtual computer, you must obtain separate copies of the software and a separate license for each copy.



    Soucre: ZDNet How the new Windows 8 license affects you

    In one statement they say you can use the Upgrade version, then say the system builder version is the right choice in most cases. You can see why there is mis-information floating around. A one point I read that the full system builder version is necessary, then I read this. I guess who knows, try it and see what happens.
    Last edited by Medico; 2012-11-02 at 06:27.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

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    5 Star Lounger
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    The only way I would even thing about getting Win8 is Win8 RT (Surface). Personally, if I do have to get new hardware, if I can't transfer my license to the new system, then I more then likely will go all Ubuntu. I want a desktop friendly OS and that is an OS that directly boots into a standard Desktop Shell with something akin to a start menu. Why Microsoft wants to go to something more akin to Win3.1 is anyone's guess. Having to create special shortcuts or use shortcut keys is just plain unacceptable for me. Why Microsoft why? lol

  13. #13
    New Lounger pszwarc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lonestarone View Post
    Hello ~ Ms. Capen,
    I too, am running the preview of win 8 in virtual box. I noticed you are doing the same, is it the real version or the preview?
    I couldn't find a way to buy/upgrade to win 8 pro, as advertised!? How did you do it?
    Thanks for your information.
    a subscriber to WS from the beginning.
    As far as I'm aware, you can't upgrade from the preview version. If you wish to use the cheaper upgrade disk, you need to wipe your VM and install XP or Vista or Win7 on it, then upgrade to Win8

  14. #14
    Lounge VIP bobprimak's Avatar
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    1) Tracey Capen is a man -- look at his picture at the head of the article.
    2) Each computer, whether a VHD, VM or physical disk or partition, must be separately licensed. No 5 for $40.00, wherever that figure come from.
    3) To license and install on a different partition or disk or VM or VHD, System Builder under Personal Use License is the way to go. This is as close to a Full Retail Version as will be offered for Windows 8. Only Pro will support some of these virtualization schemes. System Builder is available from places like Frys.com for $125.00 plus taxes, free shipping.
    4) The upgrade is just that, and is not an original license, so it has all the usual limitations of any MS OS upgrade.
    5) The swiftest way to get certain legacy programs to work on the Windows 8 desktop is to turn off Smart Screen Filter on the Desktop, which is separate from the IE 10 Smart Screen Filter. This is the main reason it feels like the UACs are crazy restrictive in Windows 8. Also, there are many Legacy Modes in Wndows 8 on the desktop, and older programs and drivers may benefit from running in a Legacy Mode. For awhile, this was the only way to run Super Antispyware as a 64-bit Windows 8 program (That issue is now fixed). And CD or DVD burning programs which don't carry their own emulators may need similar treatment. StarBurn is one of the few free programs which will do a good job with media burning, because it does carry its own Windows 8 compatible emulator with it.
    6) Preview Versions are not eligible for upgrades.

    And yes, RT (Modern UI) is much more functional on a tablet than on a laptop or desktop without touchscreen features. But the Surface is pretty flimsy in its physical design. It seems designed to break rather than be of long-term use. For the price it costs, they should have put more thought into physical durability. Especially for the over-priced docking keyboard. Lousy key feel on that add-on, too. Go into a Microsoft bricks and mortar store and try the Surface before buying it. Seriously.
    Last edited by bobprimak; 2012-11-02 at 06:40.
    -- Bob Primak --

  15. #15
    New Lounger pszwarc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bobprimak View Post
    1) Tracey Capen is a man -- look at his picture at the head of the article.
    Well, Osgood Fielding III was right, then: nobody's perfect

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