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  1. #31
    4 Star Lounger
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    As Medico has noted, opinions in this area vary - a lot. My impression is that the overall 'enthusiast' PC community is considerably more critical of Win 8 than has been expressed so far in this thread: for a much wider cross-section of opinion, you might want to look at the user reviews of the Win 8 Pro Upgrade at Amazon.com and Newegg.com (and consider that most of those reviews were written when this upgrade was selling at between $29.99 and $69.99 rather than its current price of $99.99 at Amazon and $199.99 at Newegg, so the criticism wasn't related to cost-effectiveness).

    My own assessment is that the new user interface presented by Win 8 is a pain in the butt that can be at least moderately tamed via sufficient research into changes in settings and third-party add-ons that make it work a lot more like Win 7 did. There are a few minor benefits that Win 8 has over Win 7, but if both were selling at the same price and were going to be supported for an equally long time by Microsoft I'd opt for Win 7 in a heartbeat.

    Then again, if you only need to use your computer as you describe in post #5, why on earth do you think you need anything more than you already have? I'd be inclined to wait until I actually needed something more and then see what was available that best addressed those needs (which might lead to a different choice than one you'd make today).

  2. #32
    New Lounger DAMIEN's Avatar
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    win 8 pro 64 bit

    there were a lot of good replies on this thread i read...i was initially afraid to even think about upgrade after xp w/spe...im a 57 yr old dinosaur...for christmas, my brother in indiana gave me a christmas gift...it came 1 by 1 in parts...first a monitor...then motherboard,processor,cooling fans,power supply etc...the only thing i had to do was get a cooler master tower glite for this...it also came loaded with win 8 pro 64 bit...which he also bought for me for this custom made system...quite the gift...i am fortunate to have as a best friend, a missile and computer expert from white sands missile proving ground...he helped me rebuild this behometh...win 8 pro 64 bit for me was like an alien come to visit...i like and prefer the classic windows shell...i can find everything this way...i prefer to read what im clicking on...not the eye candy tiles windows gives you and i like a start button with all icons hidden on start screen...i researched all available and am happy with classic shell which is free and very easy to set up and use...i found out there is nothing to fear with win 8 pro 64 bit...it works flawlessly and effortlessly...ive since relegated my asus eee pc notebook win xp system to doing no more than running my viop magic jack phone...that is how good win 8 pro is...to all the curious...the hardware custom builtcomponents for this machine is as follows...asustek F1A75-v evo (fm1) motherboard...AMD A8-3850 APU with Radeon HD Graphics processor...4 sticks for a total of 16 gb Corsair Vengence ram...600 watt xion power supply unit with 3 speed fan setting button...and of course win 8 pro 64 bit with media center...hope this is helpful to fellow dinosaurs such as myself...enjoy

  3. #33
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    My impression is that almost all the complaints against Win8 are the new graphic and touch screen features that can be turned off if you really hate them. The classic mode Win8 is supposed to be nearly indistinguishable from Win7.

    As I said in the previous post, Win8 seems to be a better choice unless you care about Windows Media Center and even then you just need to purchase an extra app.

  4. #34
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    You decide! Which is Win 7 and which is Win 8:

    Win7Desktop.jpg

    For those that use the default settings you will see this screen when you first boot your PC:

    Win8StyleStartScreen.jpg
    Obviously my Win 8 Style Start Screen has been customized as well.

    On my PCs I use both Start8 (my PC) and Classic Shell (wife's PC and desktop PC), so when I boot our PCs this is the screen that displays

    Win8desktop.jpg

    If you look close enough you can tell.

    My PC automatically boots to this. I have a Start Orb. YMMV!

    This is my Start Orb:

    StartOrb - Start8.jpg
    Last edited by Medico; 2013-02-15 at 04:37.
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  5. #35
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    The latest episode of TWiT had a very good panel, including Ed Bott and discussion of Win 8 came up of course and this is over 3 months in now so the arguments should be refined. Ed had the most odd argument for, in that he said windows resize on the metro screen exactly as they should, instead of having to fiddle around with arranging them on the desktop screen. I was stunned! If that's the best argument... The rest were universal in that it made little sense on a large screen or without a touch device...but y'all can listen to it for yourself if you like.

    Oops, I forgot Ed also mentioned the sync across devices, which is good but he also mentioned the lack of solid apps.
    Last edited by F.U.N. downtown; 2013-02-14 at 18:24.

  6. #36
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    Ted, it might be even more effective if you posted the start screen second, don't ask which is which, because that's not what new users are confronted with. However with the second screen depicting the Start screen and a line after that indicating that you installed Classic Shell or Start8 and ta da! Third pic just like the 1st and it would be nice to see the actual start menu responsible. Not that I'm telling you what to do, just an idea I had for what seems a better approach...more tactile disclosure.

  7. #37
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    I agree, does the change I just made have more of an impression?

    Like I have said many times, those railing against the Win 8 Style Start Screen have very simple, and in many cases free, approaches to get back to a more familiar interface. Yes it means installing a 3rd party app, but so what! We all install many 3rd party apps on our PCs. This is just one more very small app that makes a huge difference for many people.

    If you enjoy using your PC without this addition, then go for it! But if you feel more comfortable with something familiar, then go for that as well. These things are called Personal Computers because we CAN personalize them as much as we want. I just do not believe stressing over something so simple as this is a good thing. There are to many important things to stress over. This is simply too easy to overcome to spend more than a few seconds considering.
    Last edited by Medico; 2013-02-15 at 04:33.
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  8. #38
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    Yes,that steps one through the process a bit better I think. I would have made it even more obvious by showing the start menu in the desktop and save one pic but that's fine. I still don't see it as customization though, I see it as putting back something that Microsoft removed for absolutely no good consumer reason, especially when it's replacement is so inferior, talking about the All Apps screen here not just the partial Start screen in a desktop environment.
    Who knows what hair-brained idea Microsoft will come up with next so it's for that reason I think everyone should always qualify why they really like Windows 8, because if they perceive a high acceptance of Windows 8 as is they might get the idea to completely remove the desktop in some future iteration because folks are accepting the Start screen approach. The "easy to overcome" part should be on Microsoft, not the consumer; nothing about including a start menu would have precluded anyone from visiting the Start screen any time they so wished to.

  9. #39
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    To put it another way, I don't see a compelling reason to switch from Win7 to Win8 but I also do not see a compelling reason to choose a new purchase of Win7 over Win8 for a home desktop PC.

    At some point in the future Microsoft will find a way to build software that will run on Win8 but not on Win7 but I don't think that will be very soon.

    Stand pat on Win7, no real downside on Win8.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by edmcguirk View Post
    At some point in the future Microsoft will find a way to build software that will run on Win8 but not on Win7 but I don't think that will be very soon.
    That already happens. The Metro apps run only on Windows 8.

  11. #41
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    Hi

    I have not tried windows 8 i am still in the old windows xp as it is easy to use for me.. I am wondering if i buy new laptop which is 64 bits.. wont i struggle to look for software for this OS? i mean to say for my printer...

  12. #42
    Bronze Lounger Drew1903's Avatar
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    No, you won't. In the sense that 32 bit is (becoming) a thing of the past but, comparing old to new... Most x86 things will run on a 64 bit platform. Ergo, should be no hindrance. That said, one may encounter issues w/ legacy things but, generally, should be ok. Usually x86 runs on 64. Current things are usually made for 32 and x64.

    Question is more importantly are drivers available for legacy items... in most cases, there will be.

    Best advice is run the Windows 8 Upgrade Advisor. And in the case of a printer look @ the manufacturer's site to determine if the model supports Windows 8.

    However:

    No matter, it is a moot point. There is no debate between XP & Windows 8 or x64 vs x86. One cannot stay w/ XP or only 32 bit technology. If any legacy software or hardware is not compatible w/ the current OS, that has to be accepted, if not expected. Actions must ensue accordingly as par for the course & quite OK. Many things will, still, work and that is all bonus.

    Please, excuse not giving a black & white answer.

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  13. #43
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    Some printers and scanners have not been updated with new drivers. The drivers you presently use may work, but the Windows default drivers might give some functionality but you might loose some features.

    Printer and scanner manufacturers seem to be some of the worst at updating their S/W for new OSs. HP has always been notorious for this. As Drew says you will have to check. The MS Upgrade Assistant is here.
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  14. #44
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    Real life intervened else I would have gotten back to this thread sooner.

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew1903 View Post
    Question is more importantly are drivers available for legacy items...
    Indeed - in fact, by referring specifically to his printer I suspect that this is precisely what jacqhawk was getting at, so your initial and unequivocal "No, you won't" response does not seem to have been all that accurate.

    There is no debate between XP & Windows 8 or x64 vs x86. One cannot stay w/ XP or only 32 bit technology.
    My, my - such confident opinion masquerading as fact.

    There is certainly 'debate' between XP and Win 8 and it will continue at LEAST until such time as Win 8 usage really eclipses XP's (rather than the current situation where XP usage dramatically eclipses Win 8's). I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for this to occur, since https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usage_...rating_systems indicates that XP desktop usage still rivals Win 7's while Win 8 usage is still down in the noise (at well under 1/10th of XP's).

    The consequence of such continued strong acceptance of XP is that most common current software versions run happily on 32-bit XP systems (and of course will continue to forever). As the years go by NEW software versions will eventually start dropping support for XP - e.g., new Firefox versions stopped supporting Windows 2000 about 21 months after Microsoft stopped supporting that platform, though of course the versions up through 12.0 that did support Windows 2000 still run fine there - but even then updates for older versions that DO support XP may continue (e.g., Avira's respected AntiVir anti-malware product stopped supporting Windows 2000 in its new releases but even today still issues engine and malware signature updates for the last version which did support Windows 2000, thus providing effective protection).

    If any legacy software or hardware is not compatible w/ the current OS, that has to be accepted
    Not unless you actually NEED to run 'the current OS' for some reason, and most people don't need to regardless of how many Microsoft marketeers may try to convince them otherwise. They can (and a great many people DO) just happily run their legacy (plus a lot of still-current) software on their legacy system until hardware supporting that combination is no longer available when something breaks, though paying somewhat more attention to security may be prudent depending on one's exposure to various sorts of threats.

  15. #45
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
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    I suspect XPs usage is still so high because many corporate users have not yet upgraded due to the cost of doing so. It's most likely not the cost of the OS, but the cost of proprietary S/W and new H/W that in many cases has held them back. Since support for XP does not end until April 8th, 2014, these users still have time to upgrade, but I suspect we will see some scrambling by some of these users because things tend not to move fast in these corporate environs when it comes to S/W updating. I know the large University and Medical Center where our PMDs are members of has begun the process, but has tens of thousands of users. Some of their client PCs are Win 7, many are still Win XP. It is a time consuming and costly process. They began this update long before Win 8 was released and hence chose Win 7. If Win 8 had been released already, who knows what the choice would have been. Let's see what the usage statistics shown after support ends.

    Win 8 market share is now ahead of all versions of Mac, although still well behind Win 7, Win XP, or Win Vista. I still suspect the economy has much to do with people not upgrading their H/W yet. I know that is my case. H/W is expensive, especially when our present conventional laptops and desktops work just fine for our purposes. Historically more upgrades, when a new OS is released, come from new PCs rather than simply upgrading from an older OS to the new OS.

    If someone is looking at new H/W now, it is not easy to find H/W pre-installed with Win 7. Most is now pre-installed with Win 8 Standard (I'm talking general consumer use here) I just took a quick look through the Best Buy offerings. They had 5 pages of touch enabled PCs (not tablets) and every one was pre-installed with Win 8 Standard. I would suspect if I looked at an online seller I would see similar offerings as the default OS, although most would allow upgrades to Win 8 Pro, and perhaps downgrades to Win 7.

    I believe there is just too much volatility in the PC market right now due to these various reasons to ultimately predict how well Win 8 will be doing, say in Nov. this year, after 1 year of availability.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
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