Results 1 to 8 of 8
  1. #1
    New Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Adelaide, SA, Australia
    Posts
    21
    Thanks
    12
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

    Windows 8 Blue Screens

    Last November my flatmate upgraded her desktop from Windows 7 to Windows 8.

    After she got used to the new UI, all seemed to be going well. Then, a few weeks ago, she began having problems with BSOD's related to netio.sys. She found some information about updating drivers for her network card, but whatever change she was able to make didn't seem to help much, although the BSOD's did decrease.

    But about a week ago her system started to "freeze" for no apparent reason, and these "freezes" were sometimes accompanied by a BSOD caused by "CLOCK_WATCHDOG_TIMEOUT". The only way to recover from these conditions was to reboot.

    It has now become so bad that, after rebooting, there is not enough time to launch any program before the system freezes or blue screens again.

    The only information she can find about the problem suggests that she should boot in Safe Mode to update some more drivers and her system's BIOS. But she can't get a scanning program to run on the computer before it freezes to find out what drivers to update, and there doesn't seem to be any way to get the system to boot in Safe Mode. We've tried Shift-F8, but that doesn't work, and when we tried to get to the Advanced System Options using her distribution DVD, it seems to be booting into the Recovery Drive somehow and doesn't give her the option to request a restart in Safe Mode.

    She tried using Automatic Repair, but that made no difference either.

    So can anyone please give us some ideas on how to fix her system's problems?

    If we can't find something soon, she'll have to backup all her data (using a UBCD4Win CD or Knoppix or Slax), flatten her drive and reinstall Win 7, which may mean she'll lose some 3rd party programs she's paid for and installed directly from the web.

    Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

  2. #2
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    12,625
    Thanks
    161
    Thanked 932 Times in 853 Posts
    She could try a Refresh, or perhaps a Reset. Unfortunately many of these strange problems have been brought on by the Upgrade Installation, rather than the Custom Installation. Also unfortunately they seem to defy T/S and repair of anything short of a complete reinstallation using the Custom (Clean) install from DVD.

    In most cases the Upgrade works fine, but in the few cases where it does not, it really causes weird problems.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Medico For This Useful Post:

    oldmoel (2013-03-22)

  4. #3
    Super Moderator jwitalka's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Minnesota
    Posts
    4,865
    Thanks
    67
    Thanked 556 Times in 504 Posts
    You could try a clean boot to see if its a software conflict:
    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929135

    Also, open up the desktop and clean out any dust bunnies on the cpu heatsink/fan assembly with compressed air as it could be an overheating problem. You might also want to run a memory test program:
    http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolso...memorytest.htm

    Jerry

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to jwitalka For This Useful Post:

    oldmoel (2013-03-22)

  6. #4
    Super Moderator satrow's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    Cardiff, UK
    Posts
    2,138
    Thanks
    102
    Thanked 208 Times in 181 Posts
    Upgraded from W7 - not wipe 7, install 8 clean?

    A netio.sys error may be from security software remnants previously installed when it was running W7, difficult to say. Freezes are often hardware-related.

    DriverView: http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/driverview.html (download links near the bottom of the page) will enable you to check the dates of all 3rd party (non-Windows/MS) drivers currently loaded, any that are pre-W8 release date are suspect, if you need to check the origin of any unknown drivers, the DRT will help: http://www.carrona.org/dvrref.php or http://www.sysnative.com/drivers/

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to satrow For This Useful Post:

    oldmoel (2013-03-22)

  8. #5
    Plutonium Lounger Medico's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    12,625
    Thanks
    161
    Thanked 932 Times in 853 Posts
    To boot into safe mode has she tried msconfig.exe (type msconfig in the search box. Do not need to add the .exe extension) and used the Boot tab, check mark the Safe Mode box?

    If this works, when you have done whatever you wish to try, to enable a normal boot you would then need to go back into msconfig.exe and remove the check mark in Safe Boot.

    Any 3rd party app she downloaded from the internet should be available to re-download from the same source. I have saved all my keys, access codes, etc. to a Notepad file and to the notes section of Last Pass so I can do this. I have been able to originally contact the 3rd party developers to acquire my key for any I might have missed. I also have made it a habit to Save As the .exe files I download for any 3rd party app I purchased to alleviate the problem of finding it again.

    As has been already mentioned this could be a hardware failure as well.
    Last edited by Medico; 2013-03-20 at 02:54.
    BACKUP...BACKUP...BACKUP
    Have a Great Day! Ted


    Sony Vaio Laptop, 2.53 GHz Duo Core Intel CPU, 8 GB RAM, 320 GB HD
    Win 8 Pro (64 Bit), IE 10 (64 Bit)


    Complete PC Specs: By Speccy

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to Medico For This Useful Post:

    oldmoel (2013-03-22)

  10. #6
    4 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Fairfax County, Virginia
    Posts
    453
    Thanks
    8
    Thanked 42 Times in 34 Posts
    Get a Linux LIVE CD (or DVD) and boot up with that. If it's some kind of hardware or overheating problem, you should still have the problem.

    If the problem does manifest with a Linux Live CD, then you need to start checking hardware.

    Start with memory, Use something like Memtest-86, it's easy, and it's very likely to be the problem.

  11. The Following User Says Thank You to Prescott For This Useful Post:

    oldmoel (2013-03-22)

  12. #7
    New Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Adelaide, SA, Australia
    Posts
    21
    Thanks
    12
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Folks,

    First, apologies for taking such a long time to reply, and let me say thanks to all for your suggestions. I'll try to explain what happened with each one ...




    jwitalka wrote:

    > You could try a clean boot to see if its a software conflict:
    > http://support.microsoft.com/kb/929135
    >
    > Also, open up the desktop and clean out any dust bunnies on the cpu heatsink/fan assembly with compressed air as it could be an overheating problem. You might also want to run a memory test program:
    > http://pcsupport.about.com/od/toolso...memorytest.htm
    >
    > Jerry

    The problem with a clean boot is that the system freezes before there is any chance to "... type msconfig, and then press Enter", and for reasons too difficult to explain, neither myself nor my flatmate are capable of opening the case and cleaning out any dust. We haven't tried to run a memory test yet, but it may come to that eventually.




    satrow wrote:

    > Upgraded from W7 - not wipe 7, install 8 clean?
    >
    > A netio.sys error may be from security software remnants previously installed when it was running W7, difficult to say. Freezes are often hardware-related.
    >
    > DriverView: http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/driverview.html (download links near the bottom of the page) will enable you to check the dates of all 3rd party (non-Windows/MS) drivers currently loaded, any that are pre-W8 release date are
    > suspect, if you need to check the origin of any unknown drivers, the DRT will help: http://www.carrona.org/dvrref.php or http://www.sysnative.com/drivers/

    Again, as with the suggestions above, while the system freezes so quickly, it's not possible to download, install and run DriverView.




    Medico wrote (In reverse order):

    > To boot into safe mode has she tried msconfig.exe (type msconfig in the search box. Do not need to add the .exe extension) and used the Boot tab, check mark the Safe Mode box?
    >
    > If this works, when you have done whatever you wish to try, to enable a normal boot you would then need to go back into msconfig.exe and remove the check mark in Safe Boot.
    >
    > Any 3rd party app she downloaded from the internet should be available to re-download from the same source. I have saved all my keys, access codes, etc. to a Notepad file and to the notes section of Last Pass so I can do this. I have
    > been able to originally contact the 3rd party developers to acquire my key for any I might have missed. I also have made it a habit to Save As the .exe files I download for any 3rd party app I purchased to alleviate the problem of
    > finding it again.
    >
    > As has been already mentioned this could be a hardware failure as well.

    First, of course, the freeze stops her running anything, msconfig included.

    Regarding her 3rd party software, I have a background in "legacy" systems, so I do similar things to those you suggest, saving keys and activation codes and installation kits (where possible - hullo Google Chrome) to appropriate folders on a physically separate hard drive (I always try to have at least 2 internal drives in any system I buy, a "hangover" from the days when "head thrash" was a significant performance factor), but she hasn't had that "training" and tends to rely on confirmation emails and Microsoft's standard "Download" folders, all of which are on the "system" drive - the one that will be trashed by re-installation of the OS. And, sad to say, neither of us has a regular backup regime in place, so her last complete system backup is the one taken prior to the Win 8 upgrade, which is now seriously out of date.


    > She could try a Refresh, or perhaps a Reset. Unfortunately many of these strange problems have been brought on by the Upgrade Installation, rather than the Custom Installation. Also unfortunately they seem to defy T/S and repair of
    > anything short of a complete reinstallation using the Custom (Clean) install from DVD.
    >
    > In most cases the Upgrade works fine, but in the few cases where it does not, it really causes weird problems.

    We *did* try a refresh, but that's where the whole thing starts to get really out of hand!

    Before doing the refresh, we decided, for safety's sake, to backup her system's internal drive. Since the freeze stopped us using any program run from her system, we decided to use a copy of the UBCD4Win. It was an old copy, made about 5 years ago when my system crashed and needed repair, but it just happened to be handy. It booted OK, but we gradually discovered that some of the utilities we needed were too ancient to happily handle 2TB hard drives. After some ratting around in my collection of utility discs, I found a much more recent UBCD4Win and tried it. Again, it booted OK and seemed to be able to handle large drives. There were 2 utilities we thought could be used to "backup" the drive, RawCopy and SelfImage. Unfortunately I discovered that RawCopy *couldn't* work with 2TB drives so I used SelfImage instead, to basically place an image of her internal drive onto an external 2TB USB drive.

    That copy took over 20 hours (!) to complete.

    When it finished we went to just check a couple of folders and files on both drives to see that the copy was OK. And discovered that the Windows Explorer on the UBCD couldn't read either the internal *or* the external drive! The internal drive was shown as inaccessible - for unexplained reasons - and the external drive was shown as unformatted! This, as you might imagine, was disappointing - to say the least!




    Prescott wrote:

    > Get a Linux LIVE CD (or DVD) and boot up with that. If it's some kind of hardware or overheating problem, you should still have the problem.
    >
    > If the problem does manifest with a Linux Live CD, then you need to start checking hardware.
    >
    > Start with memory, Use something like Memtest-86, it's easy, and it's very likely to be the problem.

    When the two drives - internal and external - couldn't be accessed after the copy process, I decided to try a Linux LIVE CD to see if it would discover what was on the discs. First I tried the one that had been created 5 years ago to go with my old UBCD4Win. It's a KNOPPIX CD. It wouldn't boot. Don't know why. Frustrated, I tried the one that had come with the newer UBCD, a SLAX CD. It booted, almost, but finished with an error message containing a phrase like " ... should never happen ...".




    So after all that, we removed the USB drive from my flatmate's system and attached it to mine. My system also says it's not formatted, so I'm chasing "data recovery" programs to see if we can establish that there's anything on it.

    Meanwhile, she went ahead with the refresh of Win 8. There were a couple of holdups while the install claimed that the system disk was locked. We searched for ways to overcome that and finally were able to continue with the refresh. At the end, the system was bootable and didn't freeze or give Blue Screens. At last it seemed to be back together. But when she tried to download and install some of the 3rd party programs skipped by the refresh, she kept getting the message:

    C:\ is inaccessible
    Access Denied.

    Her account is supposed to be an Administrator account and the actual Administrator account has never been used - even when the system was running Win 7.

    As I said, it's really out of hand! We have no idea where to go from here, but her current plan, if her data has survived the "copy" to the USB drive, is to flatten the drive in her system and do a clean install of Windows 7. Then, further down the track, as it were, she might try Windows 8 again, but as a dual boot setup, not an upgrade.


    If anyone has any suggestions as to how we can overcome the " ... Access Denied" problem, we'd be grateful.

    Thank you all again for your suggestions so far, and apologies that this reply has turned into "War and Peace".

    Regards,

    Noel

  13. #8
    New Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Adelaide, SA, Australia
    Posts
    21
    Thanks
    12
    Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post
    Just a supplementary message:

    We used Acronis Disk Director 11 on my computer to fix the errors on the USB drive and have discovered that, because of the way the UBCD4Win allocates drive letters, and despite our most careful (we thought) planning of the SelfImage copy, we've actually "backed up" her *external* 2TB drive, not her original c: drive.

    I know that the refresh "loses" programs, but it claims to keep data. Now I'm wondering if we can get past the "C:\ ... Access Denied ... " difficulty, whether all her documents and emails and photos, etc will still be there, and perhaps, as she hasn't been able to install Office and Outlook, we might still resurrect all the old Outlook pst stuff?

    Thanks,

    Noel

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •