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  1. #1
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    File/folder issues between 2 OS on same computer

    Hi all....Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!

    I'm having some mystical file disappearances and re-appearances when moving between my Win7Pro and Win8Pro setups.

    All in one computer I have a hdd with Win7 installed with a good deal of software. On another drive I have Win8 installed as my main working system. Both OS are fully patched and on separate hdd. When I need to move from one to the other I unplug the un-needed drive, reset the BIOS boot data and boot to the desired hdd/OS. Never do I have both OS drives active at once. There are two other drives on the system that function as data drives, and are in service regardless of which OS I'm working in. It all 'seemed' to be working fine until I noticed some files started disappearing.

    Here's what happened......
    I was in the Win7 system doing some graphics work in Pinnacle Studio and saving source and output files in a particular folder on a non-OS hdd. After finishing the development and building the output files I switched over to the Win8 (my main) system. When I went to look at and backup those output files from Win8, some of them were gone! Additionally, I had backed up that entire folder to an external hdd while in the Win7 setup, but when I looked at the ext hdd from Win8, the folder was not shown at all.

    On a separate hdd I had put a test file from the Win7 setup, but when I switched over to the Win8 system the file was not there. When I switch back to the Win7 system all of the 'missing' files are visible.

    It took me a while to figure out exactly what was happening. When I did figure it out, I couldn't understand why both OS's don't see the same folders/files on a third 'data' drive.

    Can anyone 'splain to me why I can't see a file written on a 'data' drive with both OS's? I'm totally confused.

    I have searched here and google but have not found the right search terms to yield any useful results. I hope I have explained my dilemma clearly.

    Thanks in advance
    Don

  2. #2
    WS Lounge VIP Calimanco's Avatar
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    When I need to move from one to the other I unplug the un-needed drive, reset the BIOS boot data and boot to the desired hd/OS.

    Why not save all that messing about and set up a dual boot system.

    http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/easybcd.html

  3. #3
    Silver Lounger RolandJS's Avatar
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    Calimanco, quick related question, this might help OP and me. I have a partition called System Reserved on my Windows 7 Pro governed hard-drive. Will anything bad happen if I let EasyBCD install itself onto or into said partition? I have managed to make my cdrive and ddrive bootable [for W7Pro boot if cdrive doesn't, ddrive may boot]. I'll be watching this thread about EasyBCD.
    OP -- concerning your folders/files. I was told that W8 & W7 handle NTFS differently. You will have to ask the far-wiser-than I techs in here if that could be one of the technical problems.
    Last edited by RolandJS; 2014-12-31 at 23:00.
    "Take care of thy backups and thy restores shall take care of thee." Ben Franklin revisited.
    http://collegecafe.fr.yuku.com/forum...-Technologies/

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    WS Lounge VIP Calimanco's Avatar
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    Install EasyBCD on the partition with W8 on it. DO NOT interfere with any System Reserved Partitions, which should not have a drive letter and should therefore be invisible in Explorer. Having installed the program on your W8 drive, use it to set up your boot preferences, which in this case will be the option to select either W7 or W8 OS on boot, although it would work just as well for two W7 drives.

    http://www.thewindowsclub.com/system...tition-windows

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    donnyg (2014-12-30),RolandJS (2014-12-30)

  7. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Calimanco View Post
    Install EasyBCD on the partition with W8 on it. DO NOT interfere with any System Reserved Partitions, which should not have a drive letter and should therefore be invisible in Explorer. Having installed the program on your W8 drive, use it to set up your boot preferences, which in this case will be the option to select either W7 or W8 OS on boot, although it would work just as well for two W7 drives.

    http://www.thewindowsclub.com/system...tition-windows
    Thanks, Calimanco, for the EasyBCD suggestion. I had used this once before on a different configuration. I think I'll give it a go. And would it also work for 3 OS choices? I have an old install of Win8 that I'm holding on to for emergencies, in case the current one goes belly up (which it did once already.)

    But what about RolandJS's suggestion that Win7 and Win8 handle NTFS file management differently. If that is true and I do dual-boot, wouldn't they (mis)behave the same way they are currently (mis)behaving?

    And I find little info online to support RolandJS's suggestion, but it sure *looks* like he is correct.

    Thank you both for chiming in.

    Don

  8. #6
    Silver Lounger RolandJS's Avatar
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    donnyg, it appears my sources about Win7 & Win8 NTFS handling may be a bit "shortcut-ed." I think they meant my laptop's UEFI Win8 OS/OPerations & NTFS will behave a little different than my other laptop's BIOS, Win7 OS/Operations & NTFS. Although NTFS is NTFS, perhaps each Windows kinda sorta differently meddles within NTFS a tiny bit. I know I had troubles getting laptops to "talk" with each other, especially wireless. Now, everything's Windows 7, I have smoother sailing amongst the computers.

    Addendum:
    Win8/UEFI/GPT [not same as] Win7/BIOS/MBR
    Last edited by RolandJS; 2014-12-31 at 23:04.
    "Take care of thy backups and thy restores shall take care of thee." Ben Franklin revisited.
    http://collegecafe.fr.yuku.com/forum...-Technologies/

  9. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by RolandJS View Post
    donnyg, it appears my sources about Win7 & Win8 NTFS handling may be a bit "shortcut-ed." I think they meant my laptop's UEFIm Win8 OS/OPerations & NTFS will behave a little different than my other laptop's BIOS, Win7 OS/Operations & NTFS. Although NTFS is NTFS, perhaps each Windows kinda sorta differently meddles within NTFS a tiny bit. I know I had troubles getting laptops to "talk" with each other, especially wireless. Now, everything's Windows 7, I have smoother sailing amongst the computers.
    I hear you Roland. Sometimes the not so obvious simple things get in the way. I still can't 'splain what's going on here, in spite of an hour+ research on the web and at least as much here at the Lounge. Maybe I'm just not asking the question properly.

    I hope to get to the EasyBCD thing that Calimanco suggested. I have it dl'd and installed. Just need to block out some quality time to back up everything and give it a try. I had dual boot set up several months ago but it started acting stupid and so I turned it off. But I'm still not sure they will play nice together. We'll see.

    Don

  10. #8
    Silver Lounger RolandJS's Avatar
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    Yeah, I know how it goes. Awhile back, I tried Acronis Boot Manager [whatever's called], it got funky. During a Windows 7 regular boot failure, I almost could not get past ABM default. Disabled it. Wish I had uninstalled it. Lemmie know what clicks you make within EasyBCD, I'd like to learn more!
    "Take care of thy backups and thy restores shall take care of thee." Ben Franklin revisited.
    http://collegecafe.fr.yuku.com/forum...-Technologies/

  11. #9
    WS Lounge VIP Coochin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donnyg View Post
    ...Sometimes the not so obvious simple things get in the way...
    Quote Originally Posted by donnyg View Post
    ...Maybe I'm just not asking the question properly...
    Don,

    Confucius said: "any problem once correctly understood is already half solved".

    I understand from your #1 post that you have Win7 on one HDD and Win8 on another HDD.

    The Win8 HDD is almost certainly partitioned with NTFS partitions within a GPT partition.

    Problem is that Win7 cannot handle GPT partitions (not without special help, anyhow).

    Is it the case that you can successfully copy files from the Win8 HDD to the Win7 HDD, but if you try to copy files from the Win7 HDD to the Win8 HDD the files are not copied (because Win7 can't access the GPT partition)?
    Computer Consultant/Technician since 1998 (first PC was Atari 1040STE in 1988).
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  12. #10
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    Hi Coochin. Thanks for jumping in on this.

    To answer your question, I don't copy directly from one drive to the other.

    To be clear, I currently don't have both the Win7 and Win8 drives active at the same time. I copy files from the Win7 system to a *3rd or 4th drive*, but cannot see those files when I switch over to the Win8 setup. But files that were written by the Win8 system are seen by the Win7 system.

    Additionally, all of the drives are MBR partitions, including the external USB. And all are NTFS file system.

    I'm preparing to try Calimanco's suggestion to dual-boot Win7 and Win8 with EasyBCD, but I admit I still don't see a relevance to why one OS doesn't see files on 3rd or 4th drives. But I'm willing to be pleasantly surprised.

    Don

  13. #11
    Silver Lounger wavy's Avatar
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    M2cents Re dual booting, a good idea but:
    Try to figure out just what IS happening before making any changes. Make sure you are putting things where you think you are. Windows of late is using symbolic linkswhich can add to the confusion.
    David

    Just because you don't know where you are going doesn't mean any road will get you there.

  14. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by wavy View Post
    M2cents Re dual booting, a good idea but:
    Try to figure out just what IS happening before making any changes. Make sure you are putting things where you think you are. Windows of late is using symbolic linkswhich can add to the confusion.
    An interesting idea, wavy. If I were talking about using system folders and such, I might be able to consider blaming something like that. But I'm putting files in *my* folders on other-than-system hdds. I just can't imagine a situation where that would be mixed up with any system hijinks. (Nor could I have imagined that I would be having this issue.)

    But I've gotten some good ideas to research so far. I continue to dig.


    Thanks to all
    Don

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    I don't have W7 & W8 on the same machine, so can't test anything, but am currently dual-booting XP & W10(TP), and have let W10 save file history on a 'data' drive. This ends up with interesting security 'permissions' when viewed from XP. On both OS'es I am logged in as admin. Is it possible that your W7 account has 'higher' credentials than your W8 one, thus hiding the files from the W8 user? Can you see in W8 the permissions of the W7 folder with the missing files? Can you change permissions? Or enable 'show hidden files' if not already so?

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  17. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by mngerhold View Post
    I don't have W7 & W8 on the same machine, so can't test anything, but am currently dual-booting XP & W10(TP), and have let W10 save file history on a 'data' drive. This ends up with interesting security 'permissions' when viewed from XP. On both OS'es I am logged in as admin. Is it possible that your W7 account has 'higher' credentials than your W8 one, thus hiding the files from the W8 user? Can you see in W8 the permissions of the W7 folder with the missing files? Can you change permissions? Or enable 'show hidden files' if not already so?
    Both accounts are admin with full permissions. I see both permissions from both systems. And I can change permissions. And I always show hidden files.

    As of now I have the dual boot working. Thanks Calimanco for the EasyBCD suggestion and the encouragement. It's the best dual boot manager that I've seen yet.

    RolandJS, I can recommend it too, now that I see how easy it is to use.

    I did have one questionable permissions entry on one of the suspect locations, but not the other. After re-starting a few times going back and forth to make sure everything is OK, the flaky entry went away.

    As I said in a previous post, I would be pleasantly surprised if this fixed the issue. I am. It is fixed, and thanks to all of you loungers who helped.

    BTW it still doesn't make sense to me! But I learned a lot.

    Happy New Year!
    Don

  18. #15
    WS Lounge VIP Coochin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by donnyg View Post
    ...BTW it still doesn't make sense to me! But I learned a lot...
    Ah! Computers... What could possibly go wrong?
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