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    WHY the push to Windows 10?

    I wonder why Microsoft is so eager to get everyone on Windows 10. I understand not wanting to have to support older operating systems, but isn't Microsoft committed to supporting Windows 7 and 8.1 until certain dates? What do they gain by getting people off those systems before those dates arrive?

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    A large user base makes it more attractive to developers. The smaller the user base for older OSes the fewer problems get reported and the less support personnel Microsoft has to devote to these versions.

    Joe

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    Yes, I suppose that makes some sense.

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    WS Lounge VIP mrjimphelps's Avatar
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    Why? Because they can. Doesn't make it right.

    I was pretty happy with Windows 8.0, with StartIsBack. 8.1 just didn't work well on my old, lame computer; 8.0 worked great. But then Microsoft quit supporting it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjimphelps View Post
    Why? Because they can. Doesn't make it right.
    Yes, they can, but whether it's right or not, that isn't really an answer, factual or speculated, to my wondering why they would want to.

    A previous reply gave some reasonable possibilities.

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    WS Lounge VIP mrjimphelps's Avatar
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    In my personal opinion, they are trying to move everyone to a subscription model, on Windows and on Office. Office is a long way down that path, Windows is just starting down that path.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Coleman View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by mrjimphelps View Post
    Why? Because they can. Doesn't make it right.
    Yes, they can, but whether it's right or not, that isn't really an answer, factual or speculated, to my wondering why they would want to.
    "Because they can" is indeed a speculated answer as to why they might want to... Rather like why people do so many things that make others wonder - because they can.
    Cheers,

    Paul Edstein
    [MS MVP - Word]

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    Microsoft MAY make a decision to have Windows move to a subscription model sometime in the future. Right now there is absolutely no evidence that is going to happen. All statements I've seen both official and unofficial say the contrary.

    Joe

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    WS Lounge VIP mrjimphelps's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JoeP517 View Post
    Microsoft MAY make a decision to have Windows move to a subscription model sometime in the future. Right now there is absolutely no evidence that is going to happen. All statements I've seen both official and unofficial say the contrary.

    Joe
    Absolutely no evidence? They've already got Office on a subscription model, for the most part, which includes continual updates. And with Windows, it appears that soon, there will be no way to control which updates are installed, nor when they are installed. In other words, with Windows 10, you will constantly be brought to the latest version of Windows. In my personal opinion, that speaks of a subscription model

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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjimphelps View Post
    In my personal opinion, they are trying to move everyone to a subscription model, on Windows and on Office. Office is a long way down that path, Windows is just starting down that path.
    While a lot of people think this is unfounded speculation, I tend to agree. It's something that they started discussing many, many years ago. It's possible we will see a time where we will have to have a subscription to get updates.

    The immediate goal seems to be greater standardization - or at least as far as that is possible. With as many machines as possible moved to Win10 and with regular (force fed) consolidated updates, it should be expected that they will have to spend less time and money supporting various systems that could be at any state of updates.

    There's a lot to recommend this approach, but it goes against the grain of many experienced users because we've seen too many things get messed up by updates in prior versions. Basically we don't trust MS to get it right the first time, every time, and we like being able to pick and choose updates at a more granular level.
    Last edited by gsmith-plm; 2016-03-25 at 09:46.
    Graham Smith
    DataSmith, Delaware
    "For every expert there is an equal and opposite expert.", Arthur C. Clarke (1917 - 2008)

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    Super Moderator bbearren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrjimphelps View Post
    Absolutely no evidence? They've already got Office on a subscription model, for the most part, which includes continual updates. And with Windows, it appears that soon, there will be no way to control which updates are installed, nor when they are installed. In other words, with Windows 10, you will constantly be brought to the latest version of Windows. In my personal opinion, that speaks of a subscription model
    A "subscription model" by definition means periodic payments to maintain rights of use. Take for example a daily newspaper. If one subscribes to a newspaper, daily updates are delivered for that newspaper. Stop paying the subscription, no more updates.

    Frequent free software updates don't imply a subscription model—there are no associated periodic payments. Office 365 is a subscription model with a monthly/annual fee. Office 2016 is a one-time purchase, with free updates but no subscription fees. Windows is not offered as a subscription model.

    The "push" for Windows 10 is targeted toward developers; the larger the user base, the more enticement for developers of Windows Platform Apps. The more extensive the library of Windows Platform Apps, the more enticement for users to upgrade to Windows 10. The chicken and egg conundrum.

    It would seem that transitioning to a subscription model for the Windows OS would be extremely counter-productive. The business model is predicated on app sales; The Store gets a cut of each app sale. I don't foresee Apple or Android transitioning to a subscription model—it would not likely enhance the income stream from app sales from which both profit. As long as Apple and Android stay away from a subscription model, Microsoft would be cutting their own throat to make such a transition; they are trying to build a platform base, not destroy it.
    Last edited by bbearren; 2016-03-25 at 10:56. Reason: spelling
    Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!

    "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware.
    Unleash Windows

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    Super Moderator bbearren's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gsmith-plm View Post
    There's a lot to recommend this approach, but it goes against the grain of many experienced users because we've seen too many things get messed up by updates in prior versions. Basically we don't trust MS to get it right the first time, every time, and we like being able to pick and choose updates at a more granular level.
    Personally, I don't have a problem with Windows updates. With every version of Windows, I have always installed every update offered. I've been dual-booting Windows for a couple of decades, currently 8.1/10. I keep all my data on a separate logical drive/partition (on a separate physical hard drive in my desktops), seamlessly accessed from either OS. I have duplicates on my NAS. I also make frequent drive images.

    If an update pooches my system (which has been very, very infrequent for me), I'm less than 20 minutes away from a complete restoration to a known-good installation. If I need to be productive during that time, I simply boot into the other Windows installation from which I can restore a known-good drive image while I maintain access to the same data and remain productive.

    For me the Windows OS is a means to an end. Data production is the goal. I don't rely so much on Microsoft to protect my OS, and I don't depend on Microsoft at all to protect my data. I take care of those things. My backup software can run under Windows, or I can boot to a Windows PE environment to restore a drive image, or I can even boot to the proprietary backup software that doesn't need Windows at all, and restore an image.

    I'm sufficiently comfortable with my regimen that I don't use System Restore, and disable it on all my systems. I consider myself an experienced user, and I don't fear Microsoft or Windows updates.
    Create a fresh drive image before making system changes, in case you need to start over!

    "The problem is not the problem. The problem is your attitude about the problem. Savvy?"—Captain Jack Sparrow "When you're troubleshooting, start with the simple and proceed to the complex."—M.O. Johns "Experience is what you get when you're looking for something else."—Sir Thomas Robert Deware.
    Unleash Windows

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    I agree with most of that, but forsee one potential problem. If you do get a bad update that kills Windows 10, you can boot the other system, work, and restore Windows 10 to a good state, yes, but you can't go back to Windows 10 without getting the bad update again, right?

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    Let's keep the thread on track. If you want to discuss the Windows 10 update process start another thread.

    Joe

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    2 Star Lounger bobdog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Coleman View Post
    I wonder why Microsoft is so eager to get everyone on Windows 10. I understand not wanting to have to support older operating systems, but isn't Microsoft committed to supporting Windows 7 and 8.1 until certain dates? What do they gain by getting people off those systems before those dates arrive?
    Because people running windows 7 don't need to replace MS Office.

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