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  1. #1
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    Unhappy Connects to Internet but not network - Win7 and Win10 network

    This is the opposite of many of the problems seen. After a major AVG update, we lost network connectivity on (just) one of the existing PCs, but it can still get to the internet. This is a small office network with 2 Win7-Home PCs and 2 Win10-Pro PCs. The problem PC is a Win7 PC. They are all somewhat older identical model HP-P6-2123 micro towers, mostly with the same software installed, same user names/passwords, using a local WorkGroup (not the default wg name). And, they worked together just fine from the get-go until now. The other PCs can see and access files on the first PC (call it WS1). WS1 is Win7-Home, and can get to the internet no problem, but only "sees" one or two of the other PCs, and cannot access them at all. I can use Windows Explorer or File Explorer to access files on WS1, and I can ping from WS1 to the other three PCs, using both IP addresses and workstation Names, but they cannot be connected to. WS1 can also print to our network printer using its IP address, but not to the shared printer on one workstation. I have done all the easy stuff -- uninstalled the built-in Realtek network adapter and let it reinstall, installed newer Realtek drivers, turned on and off DHCP (normally I use static IP Addresses to facilitate VNC access remotely), turned on and off AVG & firewall, and used NetSH and IPConfig to reset settings, etc. Most of the Web sites I've searched talk about wireless connections and/or connect to network but not internet. This is the opposite problem, and I am stumped. P.S. I have a mixed Win version network at my home office and works fine, so that doesn't seem to be the problem, per se.

    Any ideas? Between this and a USB problem, I am starting to lean towards a motherboard hardware failure and getting a replacement PC, which is really a pain due to the vendor/industry specific airline software we use. The other possibility is to install a separate network card, but I hate to do that unless the other is really bad (and its not really). So, if I can get over this, we'll be okay.

    Thanx in advance.

    Rob

  2. #2
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    Lack of network connection implies a user/pass issue. What do the Windows logs on the other machines say when you try to connect from WS1?
    Have you tried connecting from the command line to get a better feel for the issue.
    (net use * \\ws2\share password /user:username)
    Change the names to match the work-station, share and user/pass.

    cheers, Paul

  3. #3
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    Thanx, Paul. I'll try that when I get back into the office, but honestly I doubt it will work. The user/pass thing is not likely a problem as all the computers in the office have the same access, users, and passwords. But, I'll give it a try and report back the results.
    Rob

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    Boot up into Safe Mode with Networking to see if that eliminates AVG.

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    Thanx, Sudo. I've tried that as part of the earlier troubleshooting, without success, but I can try again when I get back to the office, and will try Paul's suggestion at that time as well. I appreciate the feedback. I will report on both suggestions when I try them out.
    Rob

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    If you've already tried it then there is probably no point in doing it again.

    Was it an AVG version update or just the Definitions and are you using the free or paid for version ?

    I would try your restore points back to before the update and if that proves successful then perhaps you should consider another AV program, although it can sometimes just be a bad update and may not have the same effect second time around.

    Panda Free Antivirus has come up in the ratings and has a lighter footprint.

    http://www.pandasecurity.com/uk/home...ree-antivirus/

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    Thanx again, Sudo. We're so far into re-does that trying to find the right restore point will be difficult or impossible. Had more problems today, too. We are using AVG Business, and the other three identical PCs have not had a problem. I will be making an emergency visit to the office tonight to at least try a add-on network card, but I'm more and more inclined to think its a bad motherboard. Unfortunately, HP says this 3yr old purchase is "obsolete" and no replacement motherboard is available. So I'll have to think thru what else I can do about this. <Sigh>...

    I will keep you posted on my status. Thanx again.
    Rob

  8. #8
    Super Moderator Rick Corbett's Avatar
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    I suspect Paul T is right (post #2), i.e. that it's an account/password issue rather than any hardware fault.

    Are you using stored credentials for persistent network access, i.e. you used the network connection dialog to enter an account name, password and make the connection persistent?

    network_password.png
    Click to enlarge

    If so then there's a chance that, on WS1, one or more of the stored credentials (details of which are saved in the LSA secrets section of the registry) have been corrupted (by the AVG update?) for the PCs that can be 'seen' (pinged) but not 'accessed'.

    (I'm assuming that you have already compared network profile settings in Network and Sharing Center > Advanced sharing settings to make sure the 'problem' PC matches the 'non-problem' PCs.)

    For example, let's say you have a PC called WS1 that is used to access 3 other PCs called WIN10PRO32, WIN7HP64 and WIN7PRO32. All of a sudden you can no longer access WIN7HP64, although you can still 'see' it on your network via pings to both its IP address and workstation name.

    To check whether it's a stored credential problem, on WS1 go to Start > Control Panel > Credential Manager. There should be an entry for each PC that WS1 has previously accessed on the network. Using the 'dropdown chevron' on the right-hand side, expand the entry for the 'problem' PC, i.e. WIN7HP64 in this example.

    credential_manager.png
    Click to enlarge

    Choose the Remove from vault link and confirm the deletion:

    credential_manager_confirm.png
    Click to enlarge

    Now try to access the 'problem' PC... it should show a new network connection dialog for you to store new access credentials.

    Hope this helps...

  9. #9
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    Hi Rick:

    Interesting possibility. It fits most of the symptoms I am seeing, although when I went out to put in the new network card, it connected to the internet fine from my home office, but when we hooked it back up at the agency, I now get to neither the internet nor the other PCs, but can still use UVNC to access WS1. And WS1 can ping the other workstations, but now not the internet (usually use news.google.com for testing). Again, I have tried enabling and disabling DHCP and other foolishness, with no success. Its now giving an error about problems with the DNS server -- which might be the password problem, so I will head back out to the agency later to try your suggestions, and any others I can think of or find. I will also reboot the network router, Uverse Router and other stuff (although the other workstations have no troubles), and even try using my laptop with a wire to be sure the network outlet in the office for WS1 is not somehow damaged. That would be a kick!

    I will report back my status when I try other stuff. Thanx again for everyone's suggestions.

    Rob

  10. #10
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    DHCP/DNS doesn't have passwords, it's client / server with no write ability from the client. Errors about the DNS are more likely "can't find one" because you have hard coded something on the PC instead of using DHCP to do the work.

    cheers, Paul

  11. #11
    Super Moderator Rick Corbett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rbsteinbach
    when I went out to put in the new network card
    Rob - Your first post shows the problem started immediately after a software change, i.e. "a major AVG update". It's not clear why you are replacing hardware nor making changes to the underlying network configuration (enabling/disabling DHCP, etc). Surely the first logical troubleshooting step is to either revert or remove the AV software that apparently caused the issue in the first place?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rick Corbett View Post
    Rob - Your first post shows the problem started immediately after a software change, i.e. "a major AVG update". It's not clear why you are replacing hardware nor making changes to the underlying network configuration (enabling/disabling DHCP, etc). Surely the first logical troubleshooting step is to either revert or remove the AV software that apparently caused the issue in the first place?
    The problem still occurs in Safe Mode with Networking which will isolate AVG and restore points don't appear to be an option.

  13. #13
    Super Moderator Rick Corbett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sudo15
    The problem still occurs in Safe Mode with Networking which will isolate AVG and restore points don't appear to be an option.
    More than happy to be proved wrong but my understanding is that Safe Mode/Safe Mode with Networking both load the standard registry, with the latter just adding networking and group policy. As a result, if the 'major AVG update' caused corruption in the registry then it's likely the problem will be apparent in both 'normal' mode and 'Safe Mode with Networking', irrespective of whether the AVG driver(s) is/are loaded.

    With problems around resource sharing, remote file access, remote printing (and now a DNS issue), it's more likely that the networking's application layer is damaged (which will be apparent in both 'normal' mode and 'Safe Mode with Networking').

    IMO reversion to a point before the damage is called for. As this doesn't appear possible surely the next best option for a remote site is to remove the probable culprit and hope the uninstallation (including subsequent use of the AVG Remover utility) puts the system back before AVG added its registry settings/OS hooks? All of this can be done remotely using VNC.

    Personally I doubt this will be successful either (as I've never known any AV to uninstall absolutely cleanly without still leaving file/folder/registry fragments) but IMO it will provide a better foundation (in the absence of a system re-image) for what I think may come afterwards, i.e. doing a reset of networking using an admin level command prompt:

    ipconfig /flushdns
    nbtstat -R
    nbtstat -RR
    netsh int reset all
    netsh int ipv4 reset
    netsh int ipv6 reset
    netsh winsock reset


    then re-do the static IP address(es).

  14. #14
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    I suppose I'm happy to be proven wrong also, but it was my understanding that Safe Mode with Networking just loads the bare minimum to be functional - after all, Windows Updates don't work in that mode.

    It had crossed my mind that AVG may have screwed the registry somehow but generally, it's down to a bad Definitions update.

    Norton had to recently pull their upgrade because it was causing IE to falsely report that something wasn't working, but have since revamped it so now it's okay.

    @ Rob - quite often even though other machines can connect, a power cycle of the router can often resolve when just one has problems.

    It may even be the router's WPA/WPA2 security, so disabling that and trying to connect may produce a result, but log back into the router and turn it back on regardless and if it worked while disabled - then it should continue to work when re-enabled.

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