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  1. #1
    Star Lounger
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    Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    I've seen this behavior with both graphics and text boxes. This makes sense, I guess, since I understand that both things exist as part of the draw layer. Fair 'nough.

    What happens is that I insert the graphic or text box and anchor it to a text paragraph. Then -- when I add or insert text in new paragraphs that DO change the pagination in the document, but that should NOT affect how the anchor sits in its paragraph -- the graphic or text box behaves erratically. The most interesting behavior is when it attaches itself to the top of the page (and so looks, in page view, like it's hanging off the top of the paper) and won't move down. Sometimes it seems to disappear entirely and I can't find it anywhere in the document!

    I've tried adjusting all the formatting options, but I have to admit I'm using trial and error here -- and it doesn't seem to be working! Is there some clear reference that explains what each of the options really do and how they interact with each other (square, tight, move with text, lock anchor, allow overlap, etc.)?

    Help! It's very aggravating! <img src=/S/hairout.gif border=0 alt=hairout width=31 height=23>
    Thanks - - - Sher

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    Super Moderator jscher2000's Avatar
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    I'll admit a complete lack of understanding. I tend to use inline pictures and frames to try to work around the flakiness of the drawing layer. Don't know what these are called in Word 2002.

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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    Well now, this is pretty scary! I thought it was just me, but maybe not, huh? <img src=/S/sigh.gif border=0 alt=sigh width=15 height=15>

    Surely there has to be some resource to explain this? (Oh, what am I saying? It IS Microsoft, after all. <img src=/S/stupidme.gif border=0 alt=stupidme width=30 height=30> )

    Seriously, I couldn't find info on the MVP site or on microsoft.com. Is there a (shudder) book you (or anyone) know of that might shed some light on why these graphics might be jumping around? I do try to stay away from paying to learn how to use these tools, but there comes a time....
    Thanks - - - Sher

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    Plutonium Lounger
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    I can't point you at a book, but I can share how I work with "jumping" graphics in Word 2000.

    When I get a graphic that behaves the way you describe, I place it exactly where I want by viewing the Anchor (Tools > Options > View) and dragging it to the paragraph I want the graphic to move with. I then use Format > Picture > Layout > Advanced > Lock Anchor. I then use the other settings in the Advanced dialog box to place the picture exactly where I want it on the page. It seems to behave after doing this.

    StuartR

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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    The trick to managing the positioning of the graphics is trying to understand what the graphic is anchoring to.

    This is easier said than done however so I would always try to use an inline graphic (non floating) by preference. The file size will be smaller too.

    However, there are odd times when the graphic HAS TO float so I recommend paying careful attention to where the anchor is sitting and then visiting the Picture Format dialog and looking at the positioning parameters. Is the horizontal placement from the anchor relative to the page/margin/column/character? Is the vertical placement relative to the Margin/Page/Paragraph or Line? Will it move with the text? If you then grab the object and move it manually - check that the placement options haven't changed.

    If you come to terms with what the graphic/text box is actually told to do then the behaviour becomes a little more predictable. If that doesn't work I think Einstein wrote a book on Relativity and it appears that the MS programmers have studied this text in preparing the code for the relative positioning of floating objects <img src=/S/confused.gif border=0 alt=confused width=15 height=20>
    Andrew Lockton, Chrysalis Design, Melbourne Australia

  6. #6
    Star Lounger
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    Andrew and Stuart, thank you. I have done all the things you note. For this document, inline graphics won't achieve the effect I need, so I'm stuck with having to choose one of the others. I am looking at the anchors (but of course those appear and disappear on a sort of predictable set of actions), and I'm trying to fiddle with the advanced options. That's where I'm getting confused because the same settings in two graphics seem to do different things. And you're right, the settings seem to change on their own.

    And then there's the "jumping" aspect when you're moving from page to page or close to the upper/lower margins.....(seems to throw in a large negative value which I seem to recall from looking at previous PostScript code stuff but have never figured out what the reasoning is)....OY! I think you're right about the book those MS programmers used. I'm still confident there IS or WAS a plan -- I just want to find some way to figure out what it IS/WAS!

    Thanks for the commiseration, anyway!
    Thanks - - - Sher

  7. #7
    Plutonium Lounger
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    If you have checked View Anchors in Tools > Options > View then the anchor for your object should be visible whenever you have the object selected.

    Did you try following the advice of using the options in Format > Object > Layout > Advanced. Choose where you want the graphic to be, for example "1 cm below this paragraph, 2 cm from the bottom of the page etc." Be especially careful to think about whether it should be positioned relative to the Paragraph, the Page, the Margin, the Column etc. Then move it by setting the numbers in this dialog box, DO NOT drag it around the page to move it.

    StuartR

  8. #8
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    Yep, that's what I'm doing now. It is inconvenient to not be able to drag it to right where I want it to be, but if that's what will keep things from happening unpredictably, that's what I'll do!

    I was hoping there was some reference to help me think through the ramifications of choosing those different options (relative to page, margin, line, column, etc.), but I guess I'll just have to figure it out by intuition and trial and error.

    On a slightly different note, what exactly does "Allow overlap" mean, and do? I'm not seeing any difference whether it's checked or unchecked, but maybe I'm not using it in a way where the difference would be obvious. (Overlapping graphics margins perhaps?) Of course, Word Help doesn't have any entry at all for this option, and there doesn't seem to be anything about it on the MS Website, either. Sigh....
    Thanks - - - Sher

  9. #9
    Plutonium Lounger
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    On the Allow Overlap front. Try clicking the ? at the top right of the dialog box and then clicking the "Allow Overlap" and it will tell you that it means "Allow objects with the same wrap style to overlap".

    To test this, I inserted a clip art picture, set it to Tight wrapping with allow overlap and then copied and pasted it so that there were two of them. The two were almost completely on top of each other. Clearing "Allow Overlap" caused them to move apart.

    StuartR

  10. #10
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    Re: Jumping Graphics and Text Boxes (XP)

    Stuart, once again, thank you. I should have tried the ?, but it so often provides just obvious (i.e. useless) info that I guess I've pretty much zoned it out as an option. Lesson to me.

    Thanks for taking the time to test this out and let me know.
    Thanks - - - Sher

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