Results 1 to 11 of 11
  1. #1
    Super Moderator jscher2000's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Silicon Valley, USA
    Posts
    23,112
    Thanks
    5
    Thanked 93 Times in 89 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    If you let McAfee "clean" the template, does the error go away? If not, it sounds like a bug in the scanner, or a regrettable configuration decision by McAfee. (If anyone is shopping around for corporate AV software, we have had good luck with OfficeScan from <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.antivirus.com>Trend Micro</A>.)

  2. #2
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    Jeff,

    When McAfee cleans the template, it completely removes the source code from the offending modules. So, in answer to your question, it does make the error go away but...
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

  3. #3
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Yilgarn region of Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    5,453
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    Remember how we could create locked functions within an existing template in WordBasic and they TOOK AWAY MY TOYS?

    Well, I got some of them back!

    I have code that can {flush out old}, {detect abscence of}, and {build new} procedures in Normal.dot. Don't know if it's any use to you.



    >picking up the prohibited action of copying macros into Normal.dot.

    Why COPY procedures when you can build them directly?

    It's too late at night for my brain to function, but I do have code that can build macros in Normal.dot from hard-coded procedures in an application template. Suppose each user had a template that never changed, and THAT template obtained "code" from a text file (since YOU may want this to be dynamic, albeit from a read-only file under your control), and built that code into Normal.dot?

    I have my applications build their procedures at run-time, not at load time.

    An example of this is in my Files processor, which asks the user for permission to build a module in Normal.dot. My needs are constant - I need 3 macros "ProcessStart", "Process" and "ProcessEnd" - and I hard-wire the generation right into the application template because I don't want to distribute little text/bas files; but you could benefit from the use of external files.

    I'm rambling, I know .....

  4. #4
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    Chris,

    >Why COPY procedures when you can build them directly?

    I started with "application.OrganizerCopy"- that gave a problem with the viruschecker.

    I've now used "VBProject.VBComponents" objects to manipulate the code.

    But now our LAN people are telling us that ANY activity which manipulates normal.dot is potentially able to trigger a virus checker- so even if it does not trigger anything now, unless I can guarantee that no virus checking will ever trigger alarms.

    >I have code that can {flush out old}, {detect abscence of}, and {build new} procedures in Normal.dot.

    I have that too. But now I've triggered alarms with the LAN people, none of that is allowed now.

    >I have my applications build their procedures at run-time, not at load time.

    Our stuff is static enough to only do at load time. Originally, it only even checked once per day.
    But once a month or so, we rollout changes, and they need to be incorporated.

    If I could get the application templates to execute Autonew from the add-in (or from another common template maybe), and also to reference common procedures, I might be there. I might start looking in that direction. Our security people are also checking with Inoculan to see if there's any help on that front.

    Thanks for the ideas
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

  5. #5
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Feb 2001
    Location
    Yilgarn region of Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    5,453
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    >which manipulates normal.dot is potentially able to trigger a virus

    I'm operating with but half a mind today, but let me back off a bit:

    You're looking for a solution which doesn't EVER modify Normal.dot (except under conditions supervised by network Staff and the tea-lady, right?).

    So the task is to build an inviolate Normal.dot that is capable of doing anything you ask it.

    That used to be called "BootStrapping".

    I can think of two variations on the same technique.

    Normal.Dot has an Auto macro (or a set of Autos if you want different actions for Create Vs. Open) and that Auto macro performs a standard action whose end results can change (according to instructions you provide).


    Suppose you had that Auto macro(s) go to a text file such as an INI file and obtain from there the name of a (template and) a macro within that template which had to be run at the Auto event?

    Normal.dot never changes. You can change the INI file whenever you want (it is a *.TXT for all we care, right?), and presumably the template/macro resides on YOUR data area. A typical application would be where you as manager had a macro that checked the release version of specific templates running on the user machine (and signalled upgrades where required).


    Anyway, Wot you fink? If you're not allowed to change Normal.dot, then find a solution that doesn't change Normal.dot.

  6. #6
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    >You're looking for a solution which doesn't EVER modify Normal.dot

    Yes. Except, I guess, for the initial installation- and if normal.dot gets damaged by another process.

    I would like to have no commands at all in Normal.dot.

    Initially, I had some variables- which I set up once, and which could be accessed by all templates- that was one problem which I had not been able to get around. However, instead of storing the values in Normal.dot, I've created functions in the add-in which do the same thing. So that's one hurdle gone.

    I had some other common routines in Normal.dot, but I've now been able to move them into the add-in.

    That leaves me with the Autonew- which new templates recognise in Normal.dot but not in the add-in.

    I could have a one line Autonew which only has a single line, calling a routine in the add-in. However, that still does not get around the problem that our LAN people (and possibly Inoculan) do not like copying code into Normal.dot. Removing code is fine, but adding code is not.

    I tried setting a reference from Normal.dot to the add-in- but when I closed Word, saving Normal.dot, and opened it again, the reference was no longer there. Even this, I'm not quite sure if it did help. Initially, I saw the Autonew in the add-in, but later on, I didn't, and I don't know why.

    A reference from the template itself doesn't seem to recognise the add-in either (At least, not the AutoNew or the Document_New in the Add-in).

    So *All* I need to do is to get the AutoNew to fire when I create a document based on a template.

    I could add an AutoNew to all 500+ templates in our system, but I'd rather avoid that if I can. Apart from the size of the job, that makes it just that little more dangerous for the non-programmer who will maintain the system when I'm no longer around.
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

  7. #7
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Word- Copying Procedures and Virus Checking

    Hi,

    Word 2000, SR1

    We've had a procedure, well tested and ready to roll out to our users, to keep skeleton procedures in Normal.dot up to date without destroying their own settings.

    These routines are just one line long, and reference routines in an Add-in in the startup directory.

    There's an Autoexec in the Add-in which checks the code in Normal.dot, and if it differs from the code in the add-in, then the code from the add-in is copied into Normal.dot, and it is saved.

    There are routines which, as far as I can tell, have to be in Normal.dot. An AutoNew in Normal.dot, for instance, will get executed when openeing a template, but an AutoNew in the add-in will not.

    That's worked fine. However, we have a problem now when distributing it.

    The virus checker will not let it get copied, as it says there is a virus (W97 Generic) in the add-in. Presumably, it's picking up the prohibited action of copying macros into Normal.dot.

    I've tried several different ways of copying. One way worked until the virus checker was updated.

    We're going to be going over to a new virus checker in a little way. Inoculan does not cause the problem (yet), but our LAN people will not implement the procedure while there is a risk of this happening again.

    Has anybody had any experience of this? Are there any ways around? Could there be something like an electronic signature which could signal to virus checking software that "This procedure is internal, and is safe"?
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

  8. #8
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Virus Checking- Addendum

    Hi,

    I've been able to work out a way that we no longer have to copy code into Normal.dot, so hopefully that will alleviate the problems (Code which was in AutoNew I've moved into the module which opens the forms, so I don't need to initiate Autonew from the add-in).

    I still have to delete routines- both for the initial rollout, and for the occassions where the users' normal.dot gets corrupted, so virus checking may still be an issue. I suspect that it is much less likely to ring bells now.

    An interesting postscript. It was virus checker "X" which triggered the alarm- virus checker "Y" did not. We are moving to virus checker "Y" in the near future. When a copy of the offending template was sent to company "Y" by email, it was rejected- because company "Y" is using company "X" virus checking to check incoming mail.
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

  9. #9
    3 Star Lounger
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    246
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Virus Checking- Addendum

    <hr>Could there be something like an electronic signature which could signal to virus checking software that "This procedure is internal, and is safe"?<hr>
    I'm sure that every virus author would like that procedure. <img src=/S/laugh.gif border=0 alt=laugh width=15 height=15>
    <hr>An interesting postscript. It was virus checker "X" which triggered the alarm- virus checker "Y" did not. We are moving to virus checker "Y" in the near future. When a copy of the offending template was sent to company "Y" by email, it was rejected- because company "Y" is using company "X" virus checking to check incoming mail.<hr>
    Tells you something about what company "Y" thinks of its own product. <img src=/S/laugh.gif border=0 alt=laugh width=15 height=15>

  10. #10
    Gold Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Hollywood (sorta), California, USA
    Posts
    2,759
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Virus Checking- Addendum

    Bravo! I knew you'd have to get to this point anyway, but chiming in would have been inappropriate.
    Kevin <IMG SRC=http://www.wopr.com/w3tuserpics/Kevin_sig.gif alt="Keep the change, ya filthy animal...">
    <img src=/w3timages/blackline.gif width=33% height=2><img src=/w3timages/redline.gif width=33% height=2><img src=/w3timages/blackline.gif width=33% height=2>

  11. #11
    Platinum Lounger
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    Queanbeyan, New South Wales, Australia
    Posts
    3,730
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

    Re: Word- Virus Checking- Addendum

    <hr>
    Could there be something like an electronic signature which could signal to virus checking software that "This procedure is internal, and is safe"?

    I'm sure that every virus author would like that procedure.
    <hr>

    But they have this already in Word/Excel etc. If my site has an electronic signature, and I have documents containing macros, I can attach that electronic signature to my documents. The signature is secure, and cannot be used by outside agencies. There's one <A target="_blank" HREF=http://officeupdate.microsoft.com/focus/Articles/scrtyOvw.htm>link here</A> on the subject.
    Subway Belconnen- home of the Signboard to make you smile. Get (almost) daily updates- follow SubwayBelconnen on Twitter.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •