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  1. #1
    Star Lounger
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    FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    How much "overhead" does FrontPage 2002 add to my web site? I ask because I had something bizarre happen two days ago. Every morning I check my site's stats online via its control panel. My disk quota (50 mb max) stood at around 32 Mb. I've been modifying existing text files (sometimes as many as a hundred a day) by adding a few lines of "counter" code to each of them.

    Thursday evening (after modifying "x" number of files, and adding two new files, a 7 kb text file and a 20 kb JPEG), I came to a point where I could no longer upload. At first, I thought I was encountering a FP error, but a hunch led me back to my control panel's stats. Somehow or other, I had exceeded my disk quota of 50 mb!

    My web host provider sent this explanation late yesterday:

    "The bulk of the site usage is being taken up by a FrontPage directory. There is a directory in the _vti_txt folder called default.wti. Within it are two files called All.inv and All.m1. Both of these files are taking up over 13mb of space each. The entire default.wti directory is using 30.4mb of space. Not sure what this is exactly, but as it may be important, I will leave it up to you to tell us what to do, if anything."

    I checked the size this FP web on my own hard drive. Counting everything, every folder and subfolder, even folders beginning with "_" and all the "_vti_whatever" folders (what are these, anyway?), the total doesn't quite top 14 Mb. (The provider-named files and folders aren't on my system, but it stands to reason that FP on the server side creates additional folders and files of its own.)

    I've checked the folders online via my site's control panel/file manager, and although I haven't been able to find the folders and files specified by the provider yet, I don't doubt that they are there.

    So that's the background. Here are the questions:

    1) I know that MS is famed for its bloat code, but could they possibly be accounting for 60% of my total disk usage online?

    2) How many of the files mentioned by my web host provider actually need to be there? Can I eliminate any of them safely? If not, it's either time to: a) ditch FP2002; or, [img]/forums/images/smilies/cool.gif[/img] find a new plan or provider that allows me more room for overhead.

    Thanks in advance for any help offered.

  2. #2
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    I use FrontPage for a good deal of my own editing, but in checking the _VTI_TXT folder on my site, I saw nothing except for the .htaccess file, which I expected to find. Certainly nothing that's taking up 30MB of space. Then again, I don't use Frontpage extensions, either - so it could be attributable to that. These may be associated with search bots or other parts of Frontpage. You could try renaming them both temporarily and checking your site's functionality to see if it does any harm.

    I don't think it's FP2002 that's necessarily causing it, but I can't say definitively either.
    -Mark

  3. #3
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Mark,

    Thanks for the reply. I would fiddle with the files if I could, but they are "invisible" to me, because of the "_" character, I think. I have a message in to the administrator about how to get past this little bit of protection.

    Meanwhile, I have freed up about 1 Mb of files on my site, which dropped my disk usage from 50.9 Mb to 37 Mb. (Yes, I wrote that correctly, and, no, I can't account for the math, as I've never worked for Enron or Arthur Andersen.)

    BTW, I have gone to the MS KB and can't find anything under a search for "_vti_txt". Any clue where to get information about MS FP2002 (or MS FP2002 Ext) overhead files?

    Jim

  4. #4
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Jim,

    Just out of curiosity's sake, what FTP client do you use to connect to your site? Some will not display hidden files that begin with an underscore. You might try downloading and using SmartFTP which is free, and will display those things.

    Now, that space usage thing is really interesting. If you delete 1MB and your allocated space is that free afterwards, then how do we know for sure there isn't some kind of problem with the hosting company? I'd certainly be bringing that one to their attention! Provided of course you're not being hosted by Enron or Worldcom.... <img src=/S/wink.gif border=0 alt=wink width=15 height=15>

    I've never found any definitive source online for the little things that FP adds. Someone, somewhere has a source for these tidbits but I've not seen it yet. When I do, I'll be reading eagerly.
    -Mark

  5. #5
    Super Moderator WebGenii's Avatar
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    I started a post here <post#=238794>post 238794</post#> discussing the hidden files in an FP website. I've looked up the info I had on _vti_txt folders and added to the post.
    [b]Catharine Richardson (WebGenii)
    WebGenii Home Page
    Moderator: Spreadsheets, Other MS Apps, Presentation Apps, Visual Basic for Apps, Windows Mobile

  6. #6
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Mark,

    I never thought to FTP in. That did the trick, and now I can see the files mentioned. There are 9 "All.*" files listed, totally (today, at least) around 17 Mb.

    Jim

  7. #7
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Catharine,

    Thanks. Your chart was helpful. You mention the ALL.* files in association with WebBots. Aren't WebBots the designation that FP gives to things like Include Pages, etc.? What's the connection?

    Jim

  8. #8
    Super Moderator WebGenii's Avatar
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Remember that this information was taken from FP 97, when MS called them WebBots, now they are called Web Components (I guess WebBots and their little graphic were too cute). Anyhow, this would refer to the use of the search Web Component only, it shouldn't impact includes or the other types of components.

    cheers
    [b]Catharine Richardson (WebGenii)
    WebGenii Home Page
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  9. #9
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Catharine:

    Yes, on the menus they're called Web Components, but in the coding, for instance, for a page include actually looks like this in HTML:

    ""

    So they're still being called "webbots" in FP2002-generated code.

    Jim

  10. #10
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    Jim,

    A small (free) utility which you might want to investigate is a program called "KISSfp". The web address is http://www.vorburger.ch/kissfp/ . Check it out and see if it might meet your needs. I have been using this program for several years now to preprocess any of my sites or pages prior to uploading them to the server. The program works with FP2000 and FP2002 (XP). It integrates nicely into the FP menubar. The program strips out a tremendous amount of MS bloat - I find on average that it can reduce the size of the files uploaded to the server by anywhere from 50 to 75%. In any event, this might be your answer.

    John
    John
    A Child's Mind, Once Stretched by Imagination...
    Never Regains Its Original Dimensions

  11. #11
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    Re: FrontPage 2002 Overhead? (2002)

    John,

    Thanks. I will check into it. If nothing else, this "space crisis" has forced me to change web hosting providers, a move that turned out to be decidedly advantageous, both from a features and cost point of view.

    Jim

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