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  1. #1
    Star Lounger
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    First time boot failure

    Hi
    This is probably an old chestnut but I have searched for a solution many times and failed to find a fix.
    I have a Pentium 75MHz(remember those?)running under Windows 98. It always fails to boot first time and halts at logo screen. If I press esc the screen is blank (so no clues there). I do the Ctrl-Alt-Del thing and it resets (98% of the time) and gives the wee menu. I then enter 1 for normal boot(I've tried all the others too) and lo and behold it boots. I have tried many things to resolve this issue and every possible (I think ) combination in msconfig but he result is always the same. Bootlog.txt does not give any hints. The only clue I have is to do with the CD ROM. On a few occasions (and don't ask me why?) the dreaded blue screen appears and talks about "lost children or something" and then when I boot everything works as it should but without the CD ROM! The device manager tells me I do not have a CD ROM and of course you get the yellow exclamation points on the disk controller section of the menu. Someone once mentioned the SCSI controller or something and the way that WIndows recognises CD ROMs (i.e. badly). However, I don't really know where to begin with this and I have been in this state for more than a year! Woody's lounge is my last hope. TIA for any help
    Brian

  2. #2
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Hi Brian,

    From the startup menu, select the "Step By Step Confirmation" option and see where it fails. Enter "Y" until the system hangs.

    You can enable the startup menu at every boot in MSCONFIG under the "Advanced" options.

    It would also be helpful to know what the blue screen says - specifically! Error messages always tell a story, even if the story is that someone at Microsoft was bored and s;ap-happy the day they wrote it (There was an error but the error message could not be displayed because of another error - true story).
    -Mark

  3. #3
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Hi
    Thanks for your reply. I did not expect too many as this is a real strange one but not uncommon I believe. Sorry, I was a bit facetious with the "lost children....." thing. Unfortunately I have forgotten the exact wording something to do with child files no longer related to the parent file <img src=/S/shrug.gif border=0 alt=shrug width=39 height=15>. After I get this screen and reset my CD ROM is not recognised and the drivers are not loaded. This has a knock on effect on the disk controllers two of which get the yellow exclamation <img src=/S/exclamation.gif border=0 alt=exclamation width=15 height=15>. I have to specifically load drivers from the Win 98 rescue disk. The bottom line is that when the CD ROM is not loaded then my PC boots first time <img src=/S/doh.gif border=0 alt=doh width=15 height=15>.
    I will try your suggestions and get back to you soon.
    Cheers
    Brian

  4. #4
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Hi Mark
    I went through the step by step as you suggested. The computer hangs at the last command:
    msmouse.vxd
    Nothing happens at all then I do Ctrl-Alt-Del. The menu comes up again. I repeat the procedure and this time it boots!! <img src=/S/shrug.gif border=0 alt=shrug width=39 height=15> Confusing, eh?

    Any idea what is going on?
    TIA
    Brian

  5. #5
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    Re: First time boot failure


  6. #6
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: First time boot failure

    What loads immediately prior to the mouse?

    It sounds as though this is very consistent, meaning that you can reproduce the problem. The first boot fails, the warm reboot does not.

    Does it also fail if you were to turn off the PC (after it hangs), wait ten seconds, and then turn it back on?

    What is different about the first boot that hangs? Is this when you turn it on in the morning/afternoon/evening for the first time of the day and it has been off for a while?

    It doesn't sound like hardware or it would be more sporadic and not nearly as consistent - or it would be deadly consistent and fail every time.

    If you don't mind also try the logged boot method and post the BOOTLOG.TXT to review.
    -Mark

  7. #7
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Hi Mark
    Sorry, I've been away for a few days. You are right the problem is absolutely reproducable. This computer always lies dormant while I'm at work and then I usually use it in the evening. It doesn't seem to matter though as I get the same result every time, although sometimes it just hangs completely and I can't do a warm boot. On the next cold restart it goes through the same procedure. I noted that it hung after the last vxd file loaded msmouse.vxd. I unchecked it in the System.ini and then it hung at the vnetnios.vxd stage (the one immediately prior). I checked the bootlog.txt file and all the vxd files load except for the ndisc2..etc but that fails on just about everyone's PC and it's never been a problem before. I made sure that I was not loading real mode CD ROM drivers and I do not load the Config.sys or Autoexec.bat at the moment. It seems that all combinations give the same result. It is driving me crazy. <img src=/S/bummer.gif border=0 alt=bummer width=15 height=15>.
    If ever I change settings or load a prog that requires a restart I have to go through the same routine. Bootlog.txt enclosed
    Regards
    Brian

  8. #8
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Sorry for the delay in reply. Please see my response to Mark below. I have tried your suggestions but it is still the same result. I have enclosed a bootlog.txt for perusal.
    Regards

  9. #9
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Hi All
    It's been a few months since I first aired this enigma and its still with me. I still have to double (sometimes more because it hangs) boot and once started all is OK. The reason I write is that I received the infamous blue screen again (out of the blue!) and this time I wrote it down verbatim. Here it is in entirety:

    Your multi-function device (Opti Opti 826612A or Viper-M/N+ Dual PCI IDE Controller) has some child devices using 32-bit drivers and others using compatibility mode drivers. This configuration is not supported, so your computer has been halted to prevent corruption.

    After you restart your computer, Windows will use compatibility mode drivers for each child device attached to the multi-function device. If you want to use 32-bit drivers you may be able to obtain an updated driver for the device that caused the problem by contacting your hardware manufacturer, or you can disable the device.

    Press any key to continue

    You can see why I couldn't recall it from memory! As previously stated, once this screen has gone the computer boots first time every time....the downside is that the CD rom is no longer available or is unrecognised. Device Manager reveals:- no CD ROM and a yellow exclamation appears beside primary and secondary hard disk controllers. If you drill deeper the panel tells me 'this device is not installed , not working properly or has the wrong drivers loaded (code 10)'. Also WIndows is running in compatibility mode as confirmed from the Performance tag.
    Does this give more of a clue as to what's happening?
    TIA
    Cheers
    Brian G

  10. #10
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Sounds like you have a CD-ROM driver loading from config.sys and autoexec.bat.

    Windows is telling you that you are running two devices on one controller card. One device (hard drive?) is using 32-bit drivers, and the other (CD-ROM?) is using 16-bit drivers. Windows doesn't know how to do this. Heck, *I* don't know how to do this!

    Try editing your two startup files mentioned before to remove your CD-ROM drivers, then boot. If that doesn't work, try updating your IDE controller card drivers. I assume you are using an aftermarket IDE controller? Or is this controller built into your motherboard?

  11. #11
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: First time boot failure

    It sounds like you have a problem with the motherboard drivers. If I had to hazard a guess I would say that your problem is first detected, and then Windows forces the drives on your system into compatibility mode, which is much slower - and this also explains the loss of your CD-ROM device.

    Interestingly enough, armed with your error message, I was able to locate a few interesting things on the Internet and hopefully a solution to your problem.

    IBM's website has a patch that sounds like it targets your exact problem. Go to <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.pc.ibm.com/qtechinfo/DSET-3F6ECC.html?lang=en_US&page=brand>IBM's website</A> and read through the notes there. The driver/patch that is avaialable is designed for Windows 95 but should work with Win98. Download it and follow the instructions, and let me know if that got it for you!
    -Mark

  12. #12
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Yes!
    That was it. Absolutely brilliant! Followed the instructions and I can now boot first time and I have a CD-ROM too! Can't thank you enough. I used to use the IBM support pages a lot in the early days but for one reason or another I had forgotten that they still hold a few aces up their sleeve.
    Thanks again

  13. #13
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Thanks for your input.
    Please see solution below in my reply to WyllyWylly
    Thanks
    Brian

  14. #14
    Uranium Lounger
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    Re: First time boot failure

    Glad that worked. I can relate to the exhilaration you feel when you finally get a sticky problem resolved and life is as it should be!
    -Mark

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