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Thread: unmovable files

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    unmovable files

    I am bravely trying to help my son to partition his hard drive using Partition Magic 8.0. Keep getting an error 1527 which appears to be generated by some files which cannot be moved. Have disabled the paging file in case that was the problem, but without success. Defragged and chkdsk-ed ad nauseam.
    Am trying to partition the 120GB drive into a 30GS partition for the OS and rest for data.
    Have attached a screenshot of the defrag report. Any ideas on what the stubborn file(s) might be and how to overcome the problem. PC running XP Home SP1.
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    Re: unmovable files

    I'm not so familiar with XP, but I'm pretty sure that pagefile cannot be defragmented and is marked as "unmovable" in a defrag. I imagine that's the significant green block you're seeing. Have you tried to set the Virtual memory to "No Paging File" -> Set, then run Defrag again?

    You can reset the paging file back to the optimal size after completion. You might also try to resize partitions without paging on, but taking into account the (maximum) size of the pagefile you'll need on its partition.

    I know that with 98 that you can just delete the swapfile at boot and it will be recreated as a (empty) contiguous block, but I couldn't speak for XP.

    Alan

    Edited - A fairly obvious solution I should have thought of, which works in 98 at least:

    - Work out a max. size for your pagefile (doesn't have to be accurate - I made mine 1GB - well above what it would "grow" to on my system, but still not much in terms of modern HD real estate).
    - Create a partition of this size, and nominate it as the location of the pagefile. This will get rid of unmovable blocks on your other partitions.
    - When you've defragged, created and sized your partitions, you can (optionally) merge your 1GB pagefile partition with whichever other partition is appropriate.

    I actually keep my swapfile on its own partition (like Linux does) for good reasons that I swear by. But for each of those reasons, someone else will have a counter-reason for it to be irrelevant. I'd say it's a matter of choice really.

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    Re: unmovable files

    Thanks for the quick reply. My problem is that I can't partition the drive because Partition Magic refuses to deal with the isolated unmovable file, which doesn't disappear even when I disable the paging file and rerunning defrag. Can't run PM with the paging file disabled either. Hence I suspect it must be something else, but have no idea how to shift it to get PM to do its thing (PM usually behaves impeccably for me). The problem block appears to be the islated blue stripe (contiguous files, which are far from contiguous!)
    Cheers
    Dianne

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    Re: unmovable files

    Dianne

    One another board some years ago we had a discussion of the layout of a hard disk partition as formatted by Windows XP, and the conclusion was that the "green area" (of which one can have 1, 2, 3 fragments but usually 1 for a fairly empty hard disk -- I have 2!) were parts of the Master File Table (MFT). The first/main/initial MFT area tends to be located about 20% into the partition. Download, unzip and run in a Command Prompt window NTFSinfo C (the "C" means your drive letter) from SysInternals, which gives you a whole pile of numbers about the MFT which you previously didn't want to know, and now definitely don't!

    You could also perhaps try PageDefrag, also from SysInternals?

    The "blue area" which is getting in your way is probably a large file (or group of files) which are already contiguous (non-fragmented), and so strictly speaking doesn't need to be moved. I find that occasionally, after repeated Defrags, this area can be moved closer to the front of the disk -- but I have no idea what initiates the move! Unfortunately I'm not aware of a tool which gives the layout of the disk and enables you to point at "used areas" and be told what folder or files is located there...

    John

    PS Here's my disk, for comparison. (Note that it was sold as a 120 GB disk!)
    Attached Images Attached Images
    <font face="Script MT Bold"><font color=blue><big><big>John</big></big></font color=blue></font face=script>

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    Re: unmovable files

    That's way too big for a pagefile.

    See http://www.standards.com/index.html?...leUsageMonitor.

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    Re: unmovable files

    Change the size of the page file to some small size.

    I've never used Partition Magic.
    I always backup a drive, then repartition, then restore the files.

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    Re: unmovable files

    Ayup, NTFS has a chunk reserved for its "System Volume Information" directory.
    If PM claims to work with NTFS drives, then PM should be handling the SVI correctly.

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    Re: unmovable files

    <hr>That's way too big for a pagefile. <hr>I didn't say that that was the size of the pagefile. I said that that was the size of the dedicated partition I allocate for Windows to create the swapfile on. I then let Windows manage it, which is what I believe is the best course on 98.

    Alan

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    Re: unmovable files

    > NTFS has a chunk reserved for its "System Volume Information" directory.

    NO, NTFS does not have "System Volume Information" directory/folder or files.

    System Volume Information is generated by the XP operating system, and is located on the system/boot disk (whose file format could be NTFS or FAT-32). It has nothing whatever to do with the file system.

    Let's not muddy the waters!

    If you're saying that the "right-hand blue band" is where the SVI data is placed, I'd be interested in any evidence!

    John
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    Re: unmovable files

    You do not seem to be alone as this error has been popping up for years - here's what MS has to say about it going back to PM 6 before Symantec bought it: MSKB 308322

    Note it does not seem to have anything to do with the page file.

    Is this system running fine otherwise? Are you sure it is clean - that is have you scanned it with current anti-virus program, and a couple good anti-spyware programs, such as AdAware SE and SpyBot 1.3?

    It does not make sense that PM would not work with the Page File disabled unless you have a minimal amount of RAM - or even some bad RAM. You might want to run MemTest86 to make sure.

    You might also try running PM from safe mode if it will let you.
    Bill (AFE7Ret)
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    Re: unmovable files

    The ONLY NTFS drive I have is an external USB drive, not the boot or system drive.
    It has a System Volume Information directory.
    I'm not using win xp, i'm using win 2000.

    I have no such directory on any of the other drives, which happen to be FAT 32.

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    Re: unmovable files

    Howard

    > I'm not using win xp, i'm using win 2000.

    Then it's rather unfortunate that the OP has a problem on her XP system, then! And your System Volume Information comments appear unrelated to her problem, so there's no point pursuing the argument further.

    John
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    Re: unmovable files

    Thanks to all who weighed in with advice and commentary. The quickest solution was to reformat , installation of XP and SP2, and partitioning as desired with PM. Just couldn't get past that block! Where would we be without backups?

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    Re: unmovable files

    Dianne

    Out of interest, could you post your new Diskeeper disk layout, to see if you still have what I call the "right-hand blue band"?

    Thanks!

    John
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    Re: unmovable files

    John,

    FYI, here's a couple of articles: KB How to Gain Access to the System Volume Information Folder and MSDN Microsoft Windows XP System Restore to support your point.

    Joe
    Joe

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